Tag Team Debate Tournament #2

Starter: soulcollecter34

Category: Battles

If you know of the first one, this one is exactly the same, just an improved version. For those who don't, a brief summary. You and one other user on this site will team together and debate other teams of 2 in a knockout tournament style to crown the first official Tag Team champions (the first one didn't go so well). This time it will have to be mid-level characters. You will chose a character form the player pool and after enough people have joined you will be randomly paired up and the tournament will begin, rules are down below. I hope this one goes much better.

Replies

So we could start this if @Sir spidey picks someone weaker than absorbing man.
2+ years member.
Well, we would one more person after that.
2+ years member.
@SirSpidey is a big Thor fan right? Give him Valkyrie and let him overrate her just like Thor.
I'm here, what we doing.
2+ years member.
We are having a tournament where you team up with another person and debate with them. Read the official rules, and you get to pick a street-level hero, maybe mid-level. Iron Man is an okay mid-level if he is at Bleeding Edge or lower, Absorbing Man or Big Barda is too high. You can be Deathstroke 😁
I'm here, what we doing.
We only need 2 more people.
2+ years member.
Yeah, we would only need one, but Spidey wants to be Absorbing Man who is a higher tier, so he can't join unless he changes his mind.
@soulcollector34 how many people have joined so far.
2+ years member.
So far, only 5. You, me, AkhilPDX, NemianLion, and MOP.
2+ years member.
I have joined and I am Namor. @NemianLion is Hawkman, @ManofPower is Bane, @AkhilPDX is Spider-Man, @Marvel500 is Iron Man and you @soulcollecter34 are Colossus. My Namor is stronger than Iron Man who is stronger than Colossus who is stronger than Spider-Man who is stronger than Hawkman who is stronger than Bane. I'll create some team battles inspired by the chosen characters until you @soulcollecter34 start the debate, which I fear will end like the last one because Namor may not be overpowered but he is clearly superior to Iron Man, Spider-Man and Colossus while Bane could be killed with a single punch so powerful that it would turn Bane into tomato sauce, thus destroying Saitama's reputation as a One-Punch-Man! Even on this website Namor has 400 ton strength while Iron Man has 200 and Colossus has 150, which I admit is a bit low for Colossus, who despite his vast inferiority to Namor in fighting skills and speed, should be credited for having higher durability (which this website recognises) as well as strength (I would put Namor at 200 tons and Colossus to 300 with Iron Man being lower than the website's ratings at 150 tons). Spider-Man is 25 tons, which is undeniable, so considering his ability to easily lift 50 ton tanks and the fact that Namor has as much strength as MARTIAN MANHUNTER (!!!) then Bane, who despite his big muscles only has 5 tons, which could be lower if the relevance for high ratings is also accounted for low ratings when referring to strength, then Bane could be hurt as much as a normal human is hurt by a nuke! Bane and perhaps Spider-Man are street level! I thought this team battle is about mid-tiers, with Namor being a good example.
2+ years member.
Chill, but one, Namor is not as strong as Martian Manhunter, otherwise, he wouldn't be here. And Spidey is stronger than 25 tons.
2+ years member.
@AkhilPDX I obviously mean physically pal. Namor may have some abilities like flight and very fast regeneration when on water but cannot compare with the vast abilities of Martian Manhunter, both in potency and variety, which are enough for him to be considered superior to Superman even if Supes is clearly besting Martian in brute force. Spider-Man is 25 tons or even 15-20. He's not comparable with Dante, Danny Phantom, Loki, Luke Cage, War Machine, Magneto, Emma Frost, Thundra and Doc Samson.
2+ years member.
Character Pool - Bane, Spider-Man, Deathstroke, Hawkman, Iron Man, Cyborg, Ant-Man, Wasp, Vixen, Deadpool, Wolverine, Black Panther, Captain America, Hawkgirl, Daredevil, Batman, Nightwing, Black Widow, Hawkeye, Green Arrow, Black Canary, Red Hood, Moon Knight, Deadshot, Bullseye, Winter Soldier, Atom, Thing, Colossus, Kitty Pryde, Venom, Joker, Harley Quinn, She-Hulk, X-23, Aquaman (ONE CONDITION - He gets Trident of Neptune, not the one with Posideon and it does NOT take place near water since mostly everyone here would get decimated) , Namor (SAME as Aquaman - DOES NOT take place near water: so no use complaining about that later), Plastic Man, Vision, Blue Marvel, Quicksilver, War Machine, Cassandra Cain, Sandman, Black Manta, Clayface, Lizard, and Killer Croc.
2+ years member.
Oh yeah, I forgot Mr. Fantastic, Star-Lord, Red She-Hulk, Mera, Midnighter. You can also choose horror characters like Jason Voorhees, Freddy Krueger, etc, or Star Wars STREET level characters like Boba Fett, Kylo Ren, or Darth Maul, or other characters that fit the description like Kat.
2+ years member.
I guess we are a joint operation now, lol. It's cool though because 2 people are better than 1, anyway, I'd like to reserve Colossus as my character, I was gonna pick him anyway, but I didn't want to join in the tournament unless I have too, so that I can solely focus on judging the debates, but I got dibs on Colossus.
2+ years member.
Wow, wow, wow @AkhilPDX, Blue Marvel is WAY too powerful to be in this tournament, he defeated Hyperion who solos 99% of the people here, he should be off limits.
2+ years member.
WTF?!? Blue Marvel, I think I meant to write someone else. Oh god.
2+ years member.
Oh yeah, I meant to write Blue Beetle (Jaime Reyes) - the one that isn't FULLY on Lantern level, the one on like Spidey's level.
Actually can I team with @AkhilPDX for Spider-Man
2+ years member.
I have no problem with that, but @AkhilPDX has to agree also to have you as his partner. Otherwise it's random, but I let people choose their partner last time, so I don't see why this time should be any different.
2+ years member.
Black Panther and Spiderman does sound like a cool duo IMO.
2+ years member.
Sure, but I have two conditions.
1) Don't abandon me (very easy 😁😉
2) Please read up on the debating rules. We want to win, right? 😉
Sure man. Thx
Actually can I change to Iron man. If not I'll stick to black panther.
2+ years member.
Yeah that's fine.
2+ years member.
Yes! A Spider-Man / Iron Man duo! Perfect. Iron Man is a bit more on the Mid-Tier, but so is Spider-Man and Hawkman, so not too bad. However, you can't be Hulkbuster, Endo-Sym, Model Prime, Thor-Buster or anything on that side, but we can give you the Bleeding Edge (It is a MID tier, but no character will be at that much of a disadvantage - however, @soulcollecter34 has to agree with this armor. Also, because of this, any character that's more mid-tier than street-level with team up with a weaker hero to make it fairer.
2+ years member.
I don't pay attention to the different armors, but I'm fine with his basic, standard, vanilla armor he using on a consistent bases, basically his go to armor that has him on tear with the others in this tournament.
Yeah I can work with bleeding edge armour.
2+ years member.
I was going to make it Model Prime, but that's too much, I guess you can call in the Iron Legion if it is just standard weaker suits.
2+ years member.
@Marvel500, you'd BETTER be online. I don't want to debate EVERYTHING by myself 😉 I mean, yeah, Bleeding Edge is like, mid-level, and it's a bit high, but I want a partner, not a strong character, so PLEASE be online throughout the contest.
Yeah I'm online has the debate finally started.
2+ years member.
With Nemian, that makes 4. Just need 4 more.
2+ years member.
Cool, but no Claw of Horus. That hits with the force of a planet which is the HIGHEST of mid-levelers.
Can I join
2+ years member.
@Marvel500, yes of course.
So how does this work do I choose a mid tier hero.
If it is street level I choose black panther.
2+ years member.
So far all we have is
@AkhilPDX- Spider-Man (not surprised about the choice)
@ManofPower- Bane
Anyone else want to join?
2+ years member.
My choices for my character in this tournament, ranked in order of preference, are the following:

1. Arthas
2. Lobo
3. Magneto
4. Kratos
5. Colossus
6. Aquaman
7. Namor
8. Kratos
9. Dumbledore
10. Darth Vader

And I would like @TheNemianLion to be my tag team partner if he joins, and possibly debate for my if you @soulcollecter34 kick me out just like last time.
2+ years member.
You're still on about that? You violated the one day rule, and forced a delay of debate, that is a rule of any debate, and you broke it. The only characters on that list that are acceptable are Colossus and Namor, and I already have Colossus, so I'll have you down for Namor. As for @Nemian that's up to him, if he wants to be your partner, then you can be, but I can't force him onto a team he doesn't want. So if he agrees to it, I'm fine with it.
2+ years member.
Is there an option to not have a partner?
2+ years member.
No, otherwise it would be a handicap and regardless of how good someone might be at debating, everyone gets a partner, it's mandatory. And out of all the characters in the player pool, not and those already selected, can any of them solo a group of two, unless it's Quicksilver vs Hawkeye and Black Widow or something, but lets be honest, no one is going to choose either of those characters and if they did, there is a 1/8 chance that they end up on the same team anyway. This may be an over explanation, but to sum it up, no you must have a partner, doesn't matter how good you are at debating, you get a partner.
2+ years member.
Well, I could just pick two characters, but okay
2+ years member.
As much as I'd hate to admit it, Nemian, Spidey, and Soul are the best debaters, so all three of you are getting shipped out to different teams, period. 😁
2+ years member.
Sure, you can have Darth Vader or Namor!
1+ years member.
@soulcollecter37 I left a comment on your profile, just letting you know because it doesn't come up on the front page
2+ years member.
@Prodigy, I have responded to it, just letting you know.
Only street level? Then I choose Thor!
2+ years member.
If the rules ever change, I choose the Absorbing Man as my character
2+ years member.
They probably won't change, and even if they do, Absorbing Man is not street-level.
2+ years member.
He could hold off the entire Avengers and hold up to Thor.
2+ years member.
Well you obviously don't understand how the Absorbing Man's powers work
2+ years member.
Yeah, he absorbs and adapts, meaning he could beat anyone here.
2+ years member.
Well, he would just be the equal to everyone here, so...
2+ years member.
He still went up against Thor and held his own against all of the Avengers, meaning he could adapt to anyone here and defeat them.
2+ years member.
You literally just said that he held up against them, not that he defeated them...
2+ years member.
Holding up to the entire Avengers and being able to match and defeat beings like Thor and Hulk several times is enough to place him at mid-high tier. These characters are outmatched.
2+ years member.
Oh, so now he defeated Thor. Lol, get your s**t out of here
2+ years member.
Matching someone means you could beat them. Spider-Man matched Wolverine, and he'd beat him. Just because Thor can beat Absorbing Man doesn't mean AM doesn't have a chance. Either way, I'm not trying to argue with you. You simply can't be someone above street-level, and for you to be ANYONE, you have to accept the rules.
2+ years member.
• Definition of 'Match': "A person or thing able to contend with another as an equal in quality or strength."

• Definition of 'Beat': "Defeat someone in a game, competition, election, or commercial venture."

You can't beat someone if you are equal to them. That takes simple logic to comprehend
2+ years member.
Lol, you can beat someone after a good fight, meaning, you are close or equal in power. You might have the advantage in something else though.
2+ years member.
You can't beat someone if you are equal to them. That takes simple logic to comprehend
2+ years member.
Yes, you can, if you are smarter or the better fighter. Anyways, I never said Absorbing Man was completely equal, I said he could match Thor and he can beat people on the level of Thor.
2+ years member.
Then you wouldn't be their equal. Definition of 'Match': "A person or thing able to contend with another as an equal in quality or strength." How can he be the equal to Thor, but beat beings who are equal to Thor. Just sounds like poor power scaling to me
2+ years member.
They can still be closely related in terms of power.
2+ years member.
Well, duh. The Absorbing Man was kind of the equal to Thor
2+ years member.
Just confirming that I get the Absorbing Man...
2+ years member.
If you can prove, that despite consistently holding his own against Hulk and Thor, that he can be considered around the level of someone like Captain America or Spiderman or than yes.
2+ years member.
Do you understand how his powers work?
2+ years member.
Yes, I do, I know what his powers are, it doesn't matter how someone's power work, it matters how powerful they are. Wonder Woman's only actual powers a super strength, speed, durability, and flight, everyone understands those powers, but just because they understand how they work, she would be excluded from the tournament because of how powerful she is with them. Doesn't matter what someone's powers are or how they work, all that matters is their actual power.
2+ years member.
Okay? Well, the Absorbing Man is only as powerful as the beings around him, so obviously you don't understand how his powers work
2+ years member.
Also, are you going to change the rules?
2+ years member.
No, the rules are staying, you can give out a comic book for extra evidence, but scans are necessary, and no, extra evidence gains the same number of points.
2+ years member.
First off, I never asked you, so f**k off. Secondly, we have already gone over this and you never gave a valid reason as to why I can't use comic books as evidence (I sound so ridiculous saying that).
2+ years member.
Prove that, prove that it's fluctuates depending on who he facing, give valuable evidence of it, and I'll allow him as an option.
2+ years member.
Well yeah, but he still needs to give out scans, and you WILL accept scans. You can't ask for the comic number because it isn't required, and if you can't accept it, you don't need to join. @soulcollecter34 is right, you can give as much evidence as you want, extra numbers and all that, but still going to only gain the same number of points.
2+ years member.
I don't understand that statement. You are basically asking me to prove how his powers work. I mean, if you want examples of the Absorbing Man absorbing different things and his powers fluctuating due to what he is absorbing, I can do that, but it only takes a small amount of knowledge on the Absorbing Man to know that his powers fluctuate depending on the things he is around. So, if you really want evidence, here it is. In 'Journey Into Mystery Volume 1 #115, Page #8, Panel #2', the Absorbing Man's powers are finally revealed. His power is "...to absorb the strength of anything nearby, just as he has now absorbed the strength and appearance of the very rocks on which he stands." This is evidence of the fact that the Absorbing Man only absorbs the things he is around (also known as the beings he is around). As for evidence that his powers fluctuate depending on who he is around, on the very same page as the one previously mentioned, on Panel #6, after changing from stone into absorbing the strength and power of Thor, the Absorbing Man sates, "I can absorb the power of anyone I'm near, anyone I'm fighting. That means I'm now just as strong as you are, Thunder God. In fact, maybe even more so." I think that is all the evidence needed.
2+ years member.
No, that isn't, because #1 - Whichever comic Absorbing Man is in, he always goes toe to toe with heavy hitters. He's fought Thor and Hulk and easily traded blows with them. He is above street-level, period.
2+ years member.
Absorbing Man only gets stronger from absorbing things, but his base power is above most everyone in this tournament, especially current day Absorbing Man who is equal or very close to Hulk in terms of power in his base, as shown in The Immortal Hulk issue #9, and his absorbing powers only amplify him greatly. Even back in the early days of Marvel, he has had many showing of clashing with beings such as Thor and Hulk, and modern day Absorbing Man is far superior being able to contend with the strongest cannon form of Hulk, that being the Immortal Hulk. He is far to powerful for this tournament, no one stands a chance in a one on one, hell, he could even solo certain groups of these heroes without any absorbed materials.
2+ years member.
It's as if I am speaking to a brick wall...
2+ years member.
Too bad, the answer is no.
2+ years member.
No one asked you. Shut the f**k up
2+ years member.
Don't care, the answer is NO to Absorbing Man. Soul has to start this at some point, and we decline.
2+ years member.
You act as if your opinion matters...
2+ years member.
Too bad, he's a bit too high.
2+ years member.
Some ideas about putting characters that are neither OP, overrated or affected by PIS nor they are street levelers. Magneto, Namor, She-Hulk, Colossus, Loki, Iron Man, Carnage, Mister Sinister, Aquaman, Cyborg, Big Barda, Lobo, Gorilla Grodd, Wonder Girl, Swamp Thing, Solomon Grundy, Arthas, Samus Aran, Kratos and Dumbledore.
2+ years member.
Magneto, Loki, Lobo, Swamp Thing, and Solomon Grundy (generally) ALL high tier. Mister Sinister and Grodd are usually street-levelers.
2+ years member.
I thought Hulk, Thor, Superman, Darkseid and Black Adam are high tier. So if Hulk > Magneto, Thor > Loki, Superman > Lobo, Darkseid > Swamp Thing and Black Adam > Solomon Grundy and I don't mean narrow superiority, then my characters are mid-tier. Mister Sinister and Grodd may be street levelers physically but their psionic abilities are unmatched so they could very well contribute in a mid-tier team. I've also got some other ideas such as Piccolo, Danny Phantom, Dante and Naruto.
1+ years member.
ANDREASVER I WILL DDOS YOU IF YOU DONT STOP
1+ years member.
Stop making troll team battles. Get off this site or don't be troll.
1+ years member.
Isn't debunking and rebutting the same thing or am I just dumb?
2+ years member.
I was thinking the same thing
2+ years member.
Debunking is exposing it's not true, rebutting is arguing that it's not true... So yeah, more or less the same thing
2+ years member.
What I mean by a rebuttal, is a debunk of the debunk. I didn't feel like typing debunk of a debunk, so I used the word rebuttal instead, as rebuttals are often responses to someone trying to disprove something. If you have a claim, and someone trys to debunk it, you can refute their debunk by debunking it, or in other words further defending your claim. And since debunking a debunk is still just a debunk, so I had them scored the same amount of points.
2+ years member.
Great idea, s**ty rules
2+ years member.
Which rule do you think is bad?
2+ years member.
If you think it is the scan, I HEAVILY disagree. Usually, people don't have the time to read an entire comic when they get it, especially in a debate which has a time limit. Scans are easier and usually, people are nice enough to give out context. Plus, you can easily tell if anything is PIS or WIS from scans without wasting too much time.
2+ years member.
I don't like the 1 day response time limit and I don't like the out of context scan bulls**t. If you can't provide the comic, you haven't read it, meaning you don't rate to talk about the subject. And nice try, but I give the comic series name, issue number, page number, AND panel number. So, reading the entire comic my a**
1+ years member.
I agree people are sometimes just busy and can't respond for a day
2+ years member.
Well, the entire debate lasts 3 days and if you can't respond within a day, you are wasting the time of the other team so that's why that rule exists. As for the scans, not every comic can be found with one feat. Also, a scan is better than all of that where you have to scroll down. Once more, you don't need to read every single comic with a feat of your hero, that is unnecessary, and even if you get some feats from a respect thread, that is OKAY. Lastly, you CAN provide a comic number and all that, but you need to provide a scan along with that. Otherwise, a scan is the only thing that is actually necessary to get a point. If you decline it and fail to debunk it, the other team gets an easy win. Nothing you can do about the rules at this point. They are good and most people would rather have scans than issues.
2+ years member.
@DarkProdigy I understand that too and that's fine, but if you keep taking too much time, you shouldn't even join in the first place. If you do, you'd be letting your partner down and you'd be wasting the time of the other team, so if you can't reply in 1 day, once or twice, it is okay, but more than four or five times is a concern. If you don't reply in time, the other team wins. Simple. No matter how good of a debater you are, the other team will win. It is that simple. Right? I mean, this isn't to prove who is the best at debating. This is for fun.
2+ years member.
Then extend the debate to 7 days. "Not every comic can be found with one feat." I don't understand this statement. Oh my, god forbid you have to scroll down! Lol, get that s**t out of here. Don't try and justify your obvious lack of comic book knowledge by trying to explain how scans are better than the comics, of which the scans come from. All scans are out of context and unreliable. I will not participate in something that allows lack of context to be accepted as evidence. That would just be flat out ridiculous to participate in. When I want evidence, I want to know all the in and outs of the feat they are referencing so that I know it is legitimate
2+ years member.
Exactly, if scans are involved in the majority of someone's evidence I think they should be banned from debating
2+ years member.
Scans are the easiest and best form of evidence to post.
2+ years member.
Just it being easy, proves it is not a reliable form of evidence
2+ years member.
I'll extend the debate to 5 days, and give everyone a 3 day response period. I never said you couldn't give the comic issue also, all I said is that a scan is neccessary. I tried explaining this to you earlier but you didn't understand what I meant. If giving the comic book issue is your biggest problem with the rule, and you don't like out of context scans, then give the comic book it is from, and then the scan from that comic you are trying to use, it's that easy. Give the scan and the comic, that way, it makes it easier to find, and if they claim it's out of context , they can go read that comic themselves, it's that simple, and everyone gets what they want. If you think not reading an entire comic is lazy, then you should have no problem taking a screen shot of the comic. Not to mention, finding the comics on that readcomicsonline site is difficult because they don't have EVERY single comic book ever, and if it's not on the website, then you have to go out and buy the comic, and I doubt anyone is gonna spend money on a comic book only to read it one time, for a small debate on a website. Because the argument can be made that it's just a random comic book, that has nothing to do with the feat you are trying to convey, so if it's that big of a deal, give the comic book issue, and then the scan from that comic book that holds what you're trying to find, so if, like I said, they think it's out of context they can go and read the comic themselves, it's that simple, and everyone gets what they want.
2+ years member.
Exactly @soulcollecter34! That is super easy and you've explained it perfectly. If someone can't understand that, they are a numbnut.
2+ years member.
@Soulcollector57: Umm, no. I am not going to risk the structural integrity of my comments just to appease your ridiculous request to use out of context scans. I don't just request that I have to use comic books as evidence, I propose that EVERYONE has to use comic books as evidence, just to prove that they know what they are talking about. And what a ridiculous statement. If it isn't on the readcomicsonline website, I wouldn't be referencing it in the first place, because that website is where I do all my reading. Even if someone was referencing a comic that was not on the website, that said person could just send us pictures of the whole comic. If no change in the rules occur, drop me out of the tournament. I'm not participating in something so ridiculous
2+ years member.
Well you don't have to participate in the tournament then. I never told you to join, you decided to join, and you character still hasn't been confirmed for submission yet anyway. I never once said you are not allowed to use comic books as evidence, never said it, but what I did say is just a comic book is not enough. You can give just a comic book, that's within the rules, I never said it wouldn't be excepted, all I said is that is not enough. And one of the last points you stated in your comment, is EXACTLY what I said, give pictures of the comic book itself, if you know the source that's fantastic, give the source, but also take a picture of the page you want to reference, and post it with the comic together. Or at the very least, give the link directly to the comic, if you can find it, then post the link so it's right there and they can read it themselves. I'm not going to strictly ask everyone to give a comic issue. And I am not the one being ridiculous, far from it, I'm trying to compromise in a grey neutral area, I never once said you could give a out of context scan, what I did say was that all you have to do is give the scan and comic. Give both then, you have the comic book and the page of that comic book together, you aren't understanding what I'm saying at all. If you decide to give a comic book as evidence, then give the scan from that same comic, it's that easy, you can give both @SirSpidey, I'm not going to completely change the rules just to please you, when the majority of the people are against it, the needs of the many out weigh the needs of the few. If you don't want to participate then DON'T it's that easy, I never asked you to join, you decided you wanted to. It's not insane, to ask for the comic and the scan from it.
2+ years member.
For all we know, you could give a random comic book, that has nothing to do with what you are trying to claim, and we waste our time reading it for no reason, and that can be qualified as a delay of debate. I don't see why you have such a huge problem with giving scans YOURSELF, if you know your comics, and you know where it is from, why do you have such a huge problem with giving scans yourself? Give scans from the comics you reference and it won't be out of context, because the comic is right there to prove it's in context, or is it because you are giving comics that have nothing to do with the point you are trying to make? If your comics YOUR are reliable, then you should have NO PROBLEM with giving a scan from them. I'll say it like this. A scan is mandatory, a comic is optional, if you don't like that don't join, I'll respect your decision.
2+ years member.
@soulcollector34: Lol, "...just a comic book is not enough." Though I completely disagree with how you are allowing everyone to present their evidence, I will join the tournament, but with one condition. Sure, people can use out of context scans, but my only request is that they need to be able to provide the comic from which the scan came from upon request. If they can't do this simple task, their evidence should be completely disregarded and confirmed to be unreliable.
2+ years member.
I'm willing to compromise, here is my counter proposal. If no comic book issue is given, they will not be counted as completely unreliable, but if you give the comic book issue, you will be given additional points, 1-2, that way those without the exact comic will not be penalized, but those who add the comic book evidence will be rewarded extra, it's a win win for everyone. But all I ask of you is that you add the scan from that comic book. For example if what you are referencing is on page 8, of Journey Into Mystery #157, you tell them that, but you also take a picture of page 8 and link it with your comment, or at the very least give the link leading directly to that comic, I think that is reasonable for everyone, where no one is penalized for doing the bare minimum, but people are rewarded for going beyond what is required. I think that's fair and suits everyone's needs.
2+ years member.
@soulcollecter34 can I mention comic book issues without a scan? Because Marvel or DC wikis with tons of information mention a lot of feats for characters while not giving scans but they link to the issues where they are referenced so if I get a partner then I would like him to search for scans while I explore the wikis to find issues. But you gave me Namor if you remember. I would prefer to have Colossus because his superior durability would make him a better team player for tanking in order to guard and open the way for an aggressive but not so able to survive tag partner. But Namor at this website is listed at 400 tons, which is equal to Martian Manhunter. I could use strength feats of Martian Manhunter for Namor or @Galactus could correct the website's ridiculous ratings. But I've replied to @AkhilPDX and said that in my opinion your Colossus is 300 (not 150) tons, Namor is 200, Iron Man is 150 (not 200) and Spider-Man might be 15-20 instead of 25. Namor's underrated power might annoy you as much as Apocalypse and I don't want you to end this debate like the previous one. You should allow characters such as Magneto, She-Hulk, Loki, Big Barda, Lobo, Wonder Girl, Swamp Thing, Solomon Grundy, Arthas, Samus Aran, Kratos and Dumbledore instead of street levelers such as Bane or Namor will stomp.
2+ years member.
Namor's one of the first superheroes ever to exist and he's not promoted because he's one of the few major characters not to be created by a Jew while his creator died in 1973. Namor has been a jobber like Apocalypse but he is supposed to be way more powerful than Thor, Hercules, Hulk and Iron Man combined. His striking power is not as destructive as Thor, Hercules or Hulk but he is stronger than Iron Man, faster than Iron Man and Hulk and more durable than Thanos with Colossus being much slower despite his advantage in strength and durability while the same goes with Juggernaut who is even stronger and more durable than Namor as well as Colossus while his speed, despite being far above peak human, is still much inferior to Namor, Iron Man, Spider-Man, Hulk and even Colossus. The fighting skills of Namor are better than all Avengers except from peak humans such as Captain America, Black Widow and Hawkeye and Thor is one of the few characters that are faster than Namor.
2+ years member.
I can agree with that, but what if their scan's are so out of context that it cannot be determined if it is reliable or not, delaying the debate, which, if I remember correctly, is a violation of the rules
2+ years member.
@Sirspidey, well if something is THAT out of context it would be very noticeable and won't be counted.
@AndreasVer, I already chose Colossus before you joined which is why you can't have him, Namor was one of your choices so I gave you that as an option and you chose it but anyway, characters such as Magneto, Loki and all the others you listened is because they are TOO powerful. Magneto might lift less than Iron Man, but his ability to affect electromagnetic fields FAR exceeds his physical limits. He is an Omega level mutant which by definition can wipe out all life on Earth at the bare minimum meaning Magneto is around planet surface levels of power, continental if you want to low ball, and this is proven as he has in the past altered a planet's rotation. Loki isn't allowed because while physically he's average, his magic is extremely powerful, as he has harmed Thor in the past. No, you can't use Martian Manhunter feats for Namor. That is the single most ridiculous thing I've heard in a LONG time for one they are completely different characters, for two, I don't care what the site says, Martian Manhunter outclasses Namor in strength, and finally you can't use that as a reason to use those feats. That's like using TOAA feats for the Flash because they have the same speed, that is a flawed way of debating and no one will take you seriously. I'm not saying anyone should, it's an analogy, knowing you I had to explain that part.
2+ years member.
TOAA is an abstract entity and while most SHDB users can't comprehend such being, neither TOAA nor the Presence should exist on the website. How can anyone fight either of these two? They are representing the one true God and while anyone is in their respective universes, no one can actually fight them, because where they are, they control everything that exists, including anyone who might want to confront them, at the same time. A battle with those two is technically impossible. You can only do TOAA vs The Presence and vote if you think Marvel is superior to DC or vice versa. But TOAA or The Presence are a narrative technique of comic book writers to describe storylines but they are not directly involved in events because they are not limited into any event which happens at any moment or location in order to be a part of it as it would negate their omnipotence and omnipresence, which puts them beyond time and place. As for the Flash, @soulcollecter34, your example is awful. Flash literally is one of the fastest characters ever to exist despite his practical inability to compare his speed with TOAA. But there are many characters with a 100 speed rating that are significantly slower than Flash and their speed should not be compared to his. 100 speed, strength or anything else means above a limit that someone could discern, not maximum possible. Therefore you can't compare characters on something they both have 100 rating but Namor and Martian Manhunter could be compared if the ratings were correct, because their 95 strength means they are not as strong as King Kong, Super Skrull, Vampirella, Grimlock, Wonder Man, Spongebob, Samus Aran, Raiden, Neo, Hela, Count Dooku and Bi-Beast but they are stronger than everyone whose strength is listed below 400 at this website. If you don't recognise this website's ratings then you should not do the debate there but on Discord or somewhere else.
2+ years member.
@soulcollecter34 means Street-Level. Right? That's what we decided.
2+ years member.
I was thinking street level to mid-level, something like, the lowest being around Batman level, and the highest being around Iron Man level, or something like that, but I'm fine with just street level.
2+ years member.
Just street-level is better. The cut off would be Spider-Man or Cyborg or something.
2+ years member.
Alright, then just street level it is.
2+ years member.
I'm choosing Spider-Man.
I'm choosing Bane
2+ years member.
This is where all the important information goes, PLEASE no one reply to this thread, if you have a comment type it above, and I will get to it shortly.
Rules-
1. Each match has a time limit of 3 days, after those three days are up, the match will be scored and the next round will start.
2. If a participant is inactive for more than 1 day, they forfeit that round, and their teammate must debate for both.
3. Each debater can ONLY defend their own character, but can debate either of their opponents.
4. You must show scans for the statement you are trying to make, giving a comic book will not be counted.
5. Special scoring system for the debates will be given below this comment.
2+ years member.
Scoring System-
Claim without evidence- 1 point
Claim with evidence- 3 points
Debunking a claim- 3 points
Debunking a claim with evidence- 5 points
Rebuttal- 3 points
Rebuttal with evidence- 5 points
Each comment will be scored 0-5 depending on it's relevance to the topic, if it's poor it gets a 0, if it is good, 5 points, those points will be added to the base score (the points listed above). So the highest amount of points for 1 comment is 10.
Deduction of Points-
For every insult; -1 point
Comments that have nothing to do with the debate; -3 points
Useless comments; -5 points
2+ years member.
Examples of what these would look like.
A comment without evidence: My character has been shown to destroy planets before, and has defeated and contended with powerful beings such as _ and is multiple times the speed of light.
A comment with evidence: My character has been shown to destroy planets (link to scan) and is easily capable of massively faster than light speeds (link to scan).
Comments that have nothing to do with the debate: Well my character is similar to (random character) from (completely different franchise) and would win because that person has small similarities, and because (random political figure) is bad at what they do and is ruining (random country)'s economy where (random character) is said to live at.
Useless comments: You are wrong. My character stomps. That's not true. Prove it. You did a bad job debunking it.
2+ years member.
BTW - This one is with street-level characters, so we can see who is truly dedicated to debating, even without their favorite character. No biggy if you don't want to join, but seriously, if you say you are a good debater, try it with a different character.

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