SupermanvsJiren

Created by 10earthquakes

50 wins (54.3%)
Superman Kal-El
power stats
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Official Superhero Database stats.
42 wins (45.7%)
Jiren Jiren
power stats
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Official Superhero Database stats.

Comments

pedrofOMAIOR
Superman vs Jiren
Jiren Stomps
dog
dog 4 mo 14 d
Superman vs Jiren
Jiren jiren beat ultra instinct.
jiren easily win. he can kill superman
XSegaTeamPhilosophyX
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman https://comicvine.gamespot.com/superman/4005-1807/forums/superman-modern-age-feats-and-statistics-2089542/
I have done a Superman blog for any ignorant fanboys who thinks Jiren can beat Superman.
Uzumaki_Naruto
Uzumaki_Naruto 5 mo 13 d
Superman vs Jiren
Superman Superman punches him straight to hell
mi
mioline 6 mo 3 d
Superman vs Jiren
Jiren Stupid Dusk_Pikachu, Stupid Z_man_the_overpowered, Stupid Mr_Incognito, Stupid DarkProdigy, Stupid Aries, Stupid The_Mother_Focker, Stupid Nz13, Stupid Lapis_Lazuli, Stupid _Holy_Joe_, Stupid Yatharth, And Stupid Lord_Of_Apokolips. How Many Times Did You Say
show 4 replies
EmptyHand
EmptyHand 6 mo 3 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman Stupid mioline how many times did you cry like a baby with absolutely no intellectual logic in what he says and just wines
mi
mioline 6 mo 3 d
Superman vs Jiren
Jiren No You How Many Times Say Man
EmptyHand
EmptyHand 6 mo 3 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman No You How Many Times You Be Ignorant Child
Dusk_Pikachu
Dusk_Pikachu 5 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
Superman Why are you so salty Mioline?
Last edited: 5 mo 6 d ago.
Aries
Aries 6 mo 17 d
Superman vs Jiren
Superman Superman has 5th dimensional energy within him, Jiren doesn't scale close to imagination at all in DC.
show 2 replies
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 6 mo 3 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman You're probably referring to Strange Visitor.
shaneherald
Superman vs Jiren
Jiren thats strange visitor superman
Mr_Incognito
Mr_Incognito 6 mo 18 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman Dbz is boring. Literally every single character has fifty different modes and amplifiers and just yell all the time. Every character is made to be super powerful. At least in DC and Marvel you have people like Batman and Green Arrow and Iron Man who are just normal people. One of their most powerful characters is like a purple dog... like what? I dunno, i don't get the hype
show 30 replies
LordTracer
LordTracer 6 mo 18 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren That's a lot of stereotyping (a lot of which are incorrect). Question, have you watched the original Dragon Ball? Not Dragon Ball Z, not Dragon Ball Super, just Dragon Ball. There's almost no transformations, not a lot of screaming (which really isn't the case for Z and Super tbh), and the characters actually have to progress to get as strong as they are. Nobody starts off ungodly powerful except the villains, and even then that's a trend only in Z. Also Beerus is a cat, not a dog.
LordTracer
LordTracer 6 mo 17 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Holy hell, you're so annoying... Why do you have such an unnatural obsession with me?

Superman directly said that it was a MINIATURE black hole and he was struggling to hold on to even that. "Got it... before it fully released! But the pressure... is unbelievable! Not sure how long... I can hold on!"

Quantify taking a staff out of the Source Wall.

Superman has immeasurable speed, yes. I already knew that.

LMAO, imagine using feats from Superman: Where Is Thy Sting when that entire comic was a dream. Might wanna pay attention to context of your own feats. Even if that was a valid feat (and it most definitely is not), breaking through space and time is not a quantifiable feat, AND Kal implied that the sun of all things would kill him and he needed protection to survive it. So don't cherrypick things, mkay? The God of Death even said in the issue that it could all be called nothing but a hallucination, and the issue says numerous times that this is just going on in Kal's head.

Kal fighting Earth-2 Kal is just a universal feat.

Kal literally says Neron is making illusions. Read your own scan lmao.

Superman explicitly states that he used the Theta State against Dominus, not his base self, and everything was just in a psychic arena created by Kal. Once again, read your own scans.

Punching a timeline is a universal feat.

Superman didn't even harm Soulfire Darkseid and explicitly stated that he was a "90-pound weakling" compared to him and Orion. Plus the Source was weakened there. Context is a wonderful thing, isn't it?

This unnatural obsession you have with me is so bothersome. Go do something better with your time than try to validate yourself by debating a sixteen year old lmao. Or is quarantine just that boring for you?
Last edited: 6 mo 17 d ago.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 6 mo 17 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Oh! Now you messed up. You just admitted Superman has immeasurable speed and has a universal feat. Way to contradict yourself there, chief. I thought you were smart.

And no, I don't have an unnatural obsession with you, so stop assuming that I'm gay.

Superman survived the Sorurce Wall explosion, survived being in the Bleed and took a blast from Soulfire Darkseid.

Again, stop assuming that I have an obsession with you, kid. You're literally the one who said "hop off my d i c k" so...
Last edited: 6 mo 17 d ago.
Tyrannus
Tyrannus 6 mo 17 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
not voted Says @_Holy_Joe_ has an obsession with him. Also goes on to reply back every time with an essay.
@_Holy_Joe_ He tends to say stuff like that when you reject his advances. He did the same to me.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 6 mo 17 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman @Tyrannus It's no wonder @MoP called him Stubborn AF.
Tyrannus
Tyrannus 6 mo 17 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
not voted @_holy_Joe_ That's common knowledge at this point
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 6 mo 17 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman @LordTracer And you're the only 16-yr-old lying dip-s h i t that has a f***ing hateboner for comics here, mate. A 23-yr-old just finally beat you in a debate.
Last edited: 6 mo 17 d ago.
Mr_Incognito
Mr_Incognito 6 mo 17 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman Lot of negative energy on this thread. Try to bring it down a notch @Joe and @Tracer?
LordTracer
LordTracer 6 mo 17 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Damn, y'all really tryna pull up, huh? @Tyrannus I'd suggest you understand what's going on before making claims. Joe pinged ME. More than once.

@Joe
When did I ever say Superman wasn't universal or immeasurable? Because I believe he is both. Doesn't mean he beats Jiren.

What the hell lol, I have not once called you gay. Where did you get that nonsense from? Considering how you constantly ping me and bring up month old debates... yeah, I think you do have a bit of an obsession.

Quantify both tanking a Source Wall explosion and existing in the Bleed. And your scan of him supposedly taking a blast from Darkseid doesn't load.

Yeah, I did tell you to do that. And then you did the OPPOSITE by pinging me AGAIN. Have I not made it clear here that I hate being pinged, or...? For someone that claims he respects me so much, you sure as hell don't respect my wishes for you to stop bothering me over month old debates.

Also you really can't talk about people being stubborn lol, with how much you constantly bring up old debates (pretty much all of which are about Dragon Ball, interestingly enough).

Also nice assumptions. I love comics, far more than I do Dragon Ball. Especially Superman, he's one of my top ten favorites in DC. And funnily enough, I hate Jiren. He's a trash character with an awful backstory. Doesn't mean I'm gonna downplay him. You beat nothing lmao, you have consistently failed to counter anything I say and consistently have no response to when I debunk your points. Also nice slander and insults. Extremely mature of you. Care to provide screenshots of when I supposedly lied? By the way, flexing your age when you're older than me... really doesn't do anything positive for you.
Last edited: 6 mo 17 d ago.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 6 mo 17 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman @LordTracer

Let's see, when you told me "hop off my d i c k, mate". And considering how you keep assuming that I have an obsession with you, that's pretty clear evidence you think I'm gay.

Here's a scan of what the Source Wall and Bleed look like. More bigger than the sissy Universes you showed.


Well, this is what happens when you fail to apologize for your rancid behavior, telling me instead "hop off my d i c k, mate". I'm not gonna stop pinging you until I get an apology.

Who said anything about me assuming? I'm not just assuming, I know you are. And you saying how much you hate Jiren and love comics more than Dragon Ball isn't convincing me otherwise. You've done nothing but use those "ki" and "transcending time" arguments as evidence and you haven't even bothered to take a look at the scans that show you how far they put Superman above your characters.

And don't go jumping on the bandwagon with insults when you said to me "I didn't say you HATE it." but literally said this, and I quote

"Christ, you really cannot get over this, can you? And you're just proving you're either ignoring context or just don't know s h i t about Dragon Ball and have a hateboner for it, and I'm inclined to think the latter. Don't you have better s h i t to do than try to debate about a show you clearly dislike and clearly do not care enough to learn the actual context or pay basic attention to the things that happen to it?"

When I said I respected you, I was talking about your debating skills, not you as a person. I lost all my respect for you in general after how you lashed out at me yesterday, and you're not gonna get it back without an apology.
Last edited: 6 mo 17 d ago.
LordTracer
LordTracer 6 mo 17 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren That's a figure of speech, mate. I didn't mean it literally. I don't think you're gay, I couldn't really give two s h i t s about your sexuality tbh.

Nothing in the DC map indicates the size of the universes, what it does show is that there's 52 universes in the Bleed and that the Source Wall encompasses it. It also doesn't explain why Superman just existing in it matters, existing in something isn't a feat.

I don't see why I need to apologize for being justifiably annoyed at you constantly pinging me (something I've expressed my distaste for numerous times in the past) and bringing up old debates. But if it really makes you feel better, then I apologize.

You are absolutely making assumptions lol. If I hated comics, then why would my pfp be a comic character? Why would be favorite character of all time be Hal Jordan? Why would I watch the MCU, or the DCEU, or shows like Earth's Mightiest Heroes, Justice League Unlimited, Gotham, Krypton and various others if I hated comics? Hm? Please explain how that makes sense. I literally went over all of your scans and countered them, mate. You did not reply to my counters. I already know Superman is consistently universal and has immeasurable speed. That's still far beneath Jiren, who is at the absolute LEAST multi-universal with immeasurable speed. And that's lowballing Jiren. I said I was INCLINED to think that you hate it, I did not state as a fact that you hate it.

If you lose respect for someone just because they get tired of you constantly bothering them... then you might need to work something out about yourself.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 6 mo 17 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Then we're even for now. I forgive you and I'm sorry for acting hostile towards you. I might not read comics and I might not be a professional debater like you, but the least I can do is provide scans and evidence.

The truth is I've never actually owned a comic to read.
Last edited: 6 mo 17 d ago.
LordTracer
LordTracer 6 mo 17 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren I wouldn't really call myself a professional, I'm just kinda good at it. I used to do it for fun, but it's not really fun anymore...

Writing a comic is fun, writing is what I usually do in my free time.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 6 mo 17 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Heh, that's another way to describe one. You're more than "kinda good" at it.

Guess that's one thing we have in common.
Tyrannus
Tyrannus 6 mo 16 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
not voted @Tracer Actually I do know what's going on because you do the same things when you've lost debates to me. If you don't like getting pinged then so say calmly like a normal person instead of acting like a child. You clearly enjoy this and want to keep it going. Don't dish out what you can't take.
LordTracer
LordTracer 6 mo 16 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Funny this is that I HAVE said I don't like getting pinged before. Several times. And no. I don't want to keep this going, you constantly say that about me when it's clearly false. And you can't say I'm dishing it out when I DIDN'T START IT. The conflict is over anyways, so I don't know why you felt the need to reply.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 6 mo 16 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman C'mon @Tyrannus. We just ended this.
Clint_Barton
Clint_Barton 6 mo 16 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
not voted What are you guys trying to do? Tag team against Tracer? He wasn't even the one who brought you guys' name up. Joe literally tagged Tracer when Tracer didn't even mention him, come on now "brothers-in-arms"!
Tyrannus
Tyrannus 6 mo 16 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
not voted @Tracer Your actions indicate otherwise. You made an incorrect statement so I had to correct you.
@Holy_Joe I know I was just replying to my part.
@Clint There's none of that I just call people out when they resort to insults and bad debating like @Tracer did. You've joined in on my debates before so not sure what the problem is.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 6 mo 16 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Yeah, I know I did Clint. And I apologized, so let's just put this whole ordeal behind us and call it even.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 6 mo 16 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman @Tyrannus, what did I just tell you about all of this? I'm asking you to stop.
Last edited: 6 mo 16 d ago.
Tyrannus
Tyrannus 6 mo 16 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
not voted @Holy_Joe I know what you said I was replying to the part about me. It's over, leave it
Clint_Barton
Clint_Barton 6 mo 16 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
not voted I joined the debate on Thor vs. Hulk page if that is what you are talking about. I started debating you on Surfer vs. Thor, not Hulk vs. Thor a.k.a. not the topic you were debating before.
Plus, it wasn't anything personal.
Glad it is over, not a fan of seeing long message walls just about the insults thrown, instead of seeing refutes to my comments and sh*t.
Tyrannus
Tyrannus 6 mo 16 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
not voted @Clint Neither am I which is what I've been saying.
You joined the Hulk vs Thor debate? Was that when I said SS and Thor were comparable?
Clint_Barton
Clint_Barton 6 mo 15 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
not voted Yes, I am talking about that instance, @Tyrannus.
Tyrannus
Tyrannus 6 mo 15 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
not voted Exactly. I didn't accuse you of tag teaming me there. Anyone is free to join
Clint_Barton
Clint_Barton 6 mo 15 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
not voted It was different there buddy.
Tyrannus
Tyrannus 6 mo 15 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
not voted No it wasn't. You also joined in the middle of a separate debate that wasn't about you but I didn't complain.
Michealdem17
Michealdem17 6 mo 7 d
Superman vs Jiren
Jiren When dragon ball universe started it was all good but when stronger villains started appearing characters started becoming physically stronger and more mentally dumb without any source of power just by yelling
Comment deleted.
show 9 replies
LordTracer
LordTracer 7 mo 28 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Are you actually still on this? It has literally been over a week.

Jiren is beyond the natural laws of time. As Vados said, he transcends time itself. If she simply meant he resists the time skip, she would have specifically said that. Goku didn't transcend time at that point, Hit didn't even have the ability to stop time at that point. He only got that during the Tournament of Power. When he fought Goku, he could only move forward in time.

Jiren broke out of the time skip because he transcends time, as Vados explicitly stated. Your Goku example is not the same thing at all, because Hit couldn't actually stop time at that point.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 7 mo 28 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman I've used the week that passed to prepare for the debate between me and you.

Incorrect. The Dragon Ball wiki states that the Time-Skip is a technique where the user skips time for a tenth of a second, and in that limited time, they are able to move freely. The technique does not stop time, however, and the user's foe will still be able to move.

You said before "Jiren overcame Hit's hax via being stronger than him". That isn't the same as transcending time.
Last edited: 7 mo 28 d ago.
LordTracer
LordTracer 7 mo 28 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren For what debate, exactly? I do not recall agreeing to any other debate.

Really? You're using the Dragon Ball wiki? The same site that says there's a form called Super Saiyan A-Type and treats GT as a sequel to Super. Aight... also that explanation just supports what I said. The Time Skip is not stopping time. Goku broke through the Time Skip, Jiren broke through Hit stopping time.

When Vados explicitly explains it as Jiren transcending time, yeah, it does.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 7 mo 28 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Yes, unless you have anything better than that.

Right here, Hit is in his own dimension while Goku's not stopped in time after using the Time Skip.

From episode 72 of the anime, Vados stated Hit doesn't stop time nor freezes it, he skips it. What he does is basically move forward in time to where he'd be in X amount of seconds he can use Time Skip for.
LordTracer
LordTracer 7 mo 28 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Uh, maybe the actual anime and not a wiki that uses stuff that's explicitly incorrect (i.e. DBGT being a sequel to DBS).

That is the manga, which is an entirely separate continuity. DBS doesn't work like DBZ does when it comes to the anime and manga. They are both vastly different. And yes, that further proves what I said of Hit's Time Skip not being what stops time.

Yes, that was episode 72. Over THIRTY episodes before Jiren fights Hit in episode 111, where Hit first unveils his Time Prison that freezes whoever he's hit in time.
Last edited: 7 mo 28 d ago.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 7 mo 28 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Look, if Jiren really transcended time, Hit's time-related techniques wouldn't even phase him because he would exist on that level. Jiren's literally struggling to move there and you clearly said: "Jiren overcame Hit's hax via being stronger than him". In Super, it just has been implied that with enough power, a 3D being can overcome 4D abilities. But regardless, Hit did self-improve after this fight had taken place. Unless you can also say the Flash is 4D because he managed to resist a time stop before, Jiren doesn't transcend time by Vados' statement.

Being beyond time means either one of the two:
1. You experience the entire time-line simultaneously and the past/present/future are all one & the same to you, but are still bound to the limitations of that time-line. Examples include the likes of Dr Manhattan, or Thanos with IG.
2. You exist in a state beyond the time-line all together, and you can poke in & out of it at any point you like, without being limited by it. Examples include Mr Mxy or Living Tribunal.

Also, being "beyond time" would almost always imply the ability to time travel and moving in a time stop's not the same as time travelling.
Last edited: 7 mo 28 d ago.
LordTracer
LordTracer 7 mo 28 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren That is not ever implied in Super. I would love to see where it was ever implied that a 3-D being can resist 4-D hax. Vados does not say "Jiren has power beyond Hit's abilities." She says; "Jiren has power that transcends time itself." Plain and simple. The only reason Jiren struggled at first is because he had suppressed himself down to 4-D against Hit. Which characters in DBS have actually done, such as when Goku made himself human level to take out some criminals. Which Vados knew. The Angels can tell when someone is suppressed, Whis did it earlier when he realized Jiren was the mortal beyond the Gods of Destruction. So Vados was NOT referring to the suppressed Jiren, she was referring to a full power Jiren.

So yes, Jiren does transcend time, as Vados explicitly said.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 7 mo 28 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman No, but it is implied throughout the entire Dragon Ball mini-series that an opponent's Power Level can surpass an ability. The writer himself has stated having a higher Power Level than your opponent usually means you can overpower their abilities. Again, Hit's time-skip is EXTREMELY limited in scale/functionality. He's not stopping time, he's skipping it. The only technique that he has that can stop time is his Time Freeze, and so far, he hasn't used that on Jiren.

As I said before, in order to be beyond time:
1. You experience the entire time-line simultaneously and the past/present/future are all one & the same to you, but are still bound to the limitations of that time-line.
2. You exist in a state beyond the time-line all together, and you can poke in & out of it at any point you like.

Transcending time is not as "plain and simple" as one might think.
Last edited: 7 mo 28 d ago.
LordTracer
LordTracer 7 mo 28 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Yeah, here's the thing though. That does not prove your claim that a 3-D being can resist 4-D hax in this series. Hax scales to the user in DB unless it is explicitly stated to surpass the user. He literally did freeze time on Jiren. That's what the Time Prison is for.

Jiren surpasses time. That's just a fact. Vados said so, and there is absolutely NO reason to say she's incorrect. Your examples are most definitely not the only ways for characters to be transcendent of time, that first example isn't even being beyond time. That's just nigh-omniscience/cosmic awareness.
LuciferMorningstar
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman Superman blitzes lol

Darkseid is not Jiren or Superman level at all.
show 7 replies
Jongensoden
Jongensoden 8 mo 4 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Superman solo's 99 percent of dragon ball
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 6 mo 23 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman No, he solos 100% of Dragon Ball.
Last edited: 6 mo 23 d ago.
AkhilPDX
AkhilPDX 6 mo 23 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren He doesn't solo all of Dragon Ball.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 6 mo 23 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman No, but he does solo a majority of it.
Last edited: 6 mo 23 d ago.
Jakcj
Jakcj 6 mo 19 d
Superman vs Jiren
2 year member
Superman @HolyJoe imagine if Animation rewind was here. Telling you that Dragon Ball Z would solo the Justice League and the Avengers.

This guy clearly didn't ever pick up a Marvel or DC comic. He's just a manga reader.
ManofPower
ManofPower 6 mo 19 d
Superman vs Jiren
2 year member
Jiren I don't scale DB but even I know The Avengers and Justice League can't beat all of Dragon Ball
Jakcj
Jakcj 6 mo 19 d
Superman vs Jiren
2 year member
Superman It wouldn't be a blowout but DBZ has no chance of beating all the Justice League and Avenges too.
EmptyHand
EmptyHand 8 mo 5 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman About that darkseid vs jiren debate down there, I'm just gonna comment on how Superman did this to darkseid


And how Superman his heat Vision can match darkseids omega beams


And how he's also unaffected by his omega beams
show 5 replies
AkhilPDX
AkhilPDX 8 mo 5 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Jiren has been stated to be above Beerus (and regardless of the accuracy of the statement), it's safe to say they're relative. Superman also beats Darkseid for the sake of the plot and no matter how many wins he has, a Darkseid avatar / emanation at its peak has soloed the Justice League numerous times and has taken down characters more powerful than a herald tier hero.
Jongensoden
Jongensoden 8 mo 5 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Jiren is not even close to multiversal
LordTracer
LordTracer 8 mo 5 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren "regardless of the accuracy"
Are you trying to imply Jiren isn't superior to Beerus? Because I'd love to see what makes you think Beerus can even touch Jiren.
AkhilPDX
AkhilPDX 8 mo 5 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren @LordTracer I honestly don't know who's more powerful but I've heard conflicting arguments so that's why I said that.
LordTracer
LordTracer 8 mo 5 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Conflicting statements from where? Literally everything in the anime points to Jiren being stronger than Beerus. Hell, a full power Jiren was capable of killing Belmod (a God of Destruction that's physically stronger than Beerus) with his aura alone. And Jiren has his limit breaker state on top of that, which was able to hold its own against Ultra Instinct Goku.
EmptyHand
EmptyHand 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman Superman wins
show 1 reply
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 6 mo 21 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Yes.
AkhilPDX
AkhilPDX 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Jiren would basically repeat what Doomsday did to Superman but better. He's on the same tier as someone like Darkseid (avatar).
show 49 replies
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman I'm sorry, but Jiren is nowhere as powerful as Darkseid.
LordTracer
LordTracer 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Correct. He's stronger.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman No! Jiren's definitely not stronger than Darkseid. Against Post -Crisis Superman, maybe, but Darkseid's on an entire different level. As I said before, Darkseid's fall mere fall broke the Multiversal structure and damaged the Orrey of Worlds with the 5D Bleed across all of time. He nearly succeeded in dragging the contents of the Orrery into a multiversal singularity and everything was one with him. While dying, he created an endless number of realities to torture Shilo Norman and charged Batman with enough Omega radiation to destroy time.
Last edited: 8 mo 6 d ago.
LordTracer
LordTracer 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Mate, all of that is Darkseid's true form. Akhil explicitly said Darkseid's avatars.

Plus I could easily argue Jiren slaps Darkseid's true form as well.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Bro, can you stop calling me "mate"? You're not Australian.

Even when he was significantly weakened, Darkseid defeated both Mordru and the Time Trapper Controller and absorbed their energies and the energy from all of the Sorcerer's World. He was still weaker than normal at that point, but Highfather stated Darkseid was capable of destroying Takion, who also admitted Darkseid was more powerful than him. He took absolutely no damageagainst Pre-Crisis Superboy and Supergirl who were heavily amped and his Omega Beams caused massive pain to the Spectre. Darkseid is so powerful that time collapses when he's removed from his proper place in the timestream and even his consciousness survived in order to channel power after being trapped in limbo.
Last edited: 8 mo 6 d ago.
LordTracer
LordTracer 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren And? I can say mate if I want. Australians aren't the only people that say mate.

Also are you just taking this stuff off of VSBW? Because a lot of your scans are on the Darkseid page, lol. Assuming you are, you must have noticed that those feats are for Darkseid's EMANATIONS, not his avatars. Also okay, time collapses when Darkseid is removed from the timestream. Tell me how that's combat applicable, or anything more than a chain reaction. And Jiren transcends time entirely, so not impressive anyways. And feats of Darkseid being stronger than people, that matters why?
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Ironic coming from you. You have OCs that contain the same profile layout that the wiki uses for their characters and you always say that sites like ComicVine are not reliable sources. I never even said anything about Darkseid's avatars.

Apparently, you forgot that Darkseid took absolutely no damage against a heavily amped Pre-Crisis Supergirl who fought against a being named Blackstarr, who had control over the universe in every aspect. He survived a bomb that ripped existence apart. Darkseid's even tanked his own Omega Beams and boom spheres' spatial rendering and his infinite Omega Effect couldn't put him down for good.

So what if Jiren transcends time? Darkseid literally destroys it. As I said before if you were listening, time collapses when removed from his proper place in the timestream. He tore a past version of him from out of the timestream which caused a major collapse. Hell, he could just simply teleport him away like he did to Slobo, Infinity Man, Superman, and the Forever People. Also, he knows how to stop time and the universe collapsing from reaching the present.
Last edited: 8 mo 6 d ago.
LordTracer
LordTracer 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren I use their profile layout because it's nice and organized, and I actually use the same layout as FC/OC Wiki, for your information. What does that have to with you using nearly the exact same wording and scans as them? Oh yeah, there's no correlation whatsoever. And ComicVine isn't reliable, why is that relevant? Akhil was the one that compared Jiren and Darkseid, and he explicitly said Darkseid's avatars. So, this is about his avatars.

Wow, universal durability. I'm not impressed, Jiren has tanked a Kamehameha from Goku, who already showed multi-universal power at the beginning of DBS. Hell, even Buuhan was destroying the universe just by screaming in DBZ.

Teleporting Jiren away is BFR, aka, Darkseid would basically be running from the fight. And again, that destroying the time stuff is done through a chain reaction and is absolutely not combat applicable. And Jiren completely transcending time means destroying time wouldn't affect him at all, so...
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Which wiki do you think that one you mentioned is partnered with and where do you think they got the same ideas? If you've read the notes in the Rules section of that site, it clearly states how small they are in comparison to that of VS Battles.

And Darkseid's more durable than you say he is. Again, he survived a bomb that ripped existence apart, his consciousness survived in order to channel power after being trapped in limbo, returned to life after being destroyed by the Spectre, tanked his own Omega Beams and boom spheres' spatial rendering, and was even unaffected by Zeus' lightning. Zeus is beyond time and space and even Darkseid's infinite Omega Effect couldn't put him down for good.
Last edited: 8 mo 6 d ago.
Jakcj
Jakcj 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
2 year member
Superman Also for a heads up. Don't even bother using wikipedia that's also unreliable
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman And here's another thing, Darkseid's countless of times smarter than Jiren. Darkseid regularly has draws in chess matches against Eclipso, can remember events from erased timelines, turned Mars into an Apokolips copy, made a machine to enter the Source, built a spaceship larger than the state of New York, and manipulated people like Mary Marvel into turning evil again, Captain Marvel into making him self-doubt himself, and even Orion into killing himself in the Source and poisoning it. From what that tells you, Darkseid could manipulate Jiren into killing himself or even doubting himself.

Sure, you could argue that Jiren's the better combatant just like Goku, but Darkseid's just as skilled as Orion, who is New Genesis's finest warrior that used a superior set of skills to defeat Kailbak.
Last edited: 8 mo 6 d ago.
LordTracer
LordTracer 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren I see you didn't answer my question on how me using the same format is relevant to you using the exact same scans and wording as them. Or my question on how ComicVine's unreliability is relevant. Also you didn't acknowledge how this discussion started based on the comparison of Jiren and Darkseid's avatars.

Yeah, everything you just said can be considered universal. "Ripped existence apart," what is "existence" in this context? "His consciousness survived," so his body didn't even survive which means this isn't a durability feat. "after being destroyed by The Spectre," his body got destroyed so again, not a durability feat. "Tanked his own Omega Beams," based on the scans you've given so far, that's merely universal. "Zeus is beyond space and time," he's existing somewhere beyond space-time, that doesn't mean Zeus himself is beyond space-time. By that logic, humans are 4-D because we exist in a space-time continuum. "Infinite Omega Effect," just being called infinite means nothing. At best, that means infinite 3-D, which is beneath baseline universal.

That Orion scan does not say anything remotely close to making Orion kill himself, and making Jiren doubt himself would just bring out his limit breaker state that was able to hold its own against Goku with a completed Ultra Instinct. Aka, he slaps Darkseid even harder.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Okay, you know what? Show me some scans, because so far, I have not seen a single feat of Jiren from you. I've provided you so many feats of Darkseid's potential and you are just disregarding everything.

Battles and fights are not solely based on raw strength, speed, and durability. There are a number of other factors such as intelligence and abilities that determine the victor. Why do you think Superman was able to beat Goku in that Death Battle? His ability to utilize his vision-like powers and combine them with pressure point strikes is what gave him an upper hand in that battle and his power to absorb the sunlight made Goku tire out of his SSJ4 state. You continually use the characters' physical characteristics and hardly ever take the different advantages that one has over the other into consideration. That's what you struggle with.

I've specifically told you that Darkseid can transmutate his foes and create multiple realities. I even told you about his superior intelligence he has over Jiren. And you blatantly ignored it.
Last edited: 8 mo 6 d ago.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman I'll have you know that ComicVine and VS Battles aren't the only sites I get my scans from. I also use reddit and other sites where I can read comics onlincle. But since you think that ComicVine and VS Battles wiki aren't reliable sources, then I want you to show me a legitimate list of Jiren's feats taken from some of the websites you actually find useful.
Last edited: 8 mo 6 d ago.
LordTracer
LordTracer 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Please explain how I'm acting high and mighty. I'm simply going over what you've given and explaining why it means nothing. But you want Jiren's feats? Bet.


Jiren transcends time itself. He doesn't merely exist in a realm beyond time, like Zeus did in your scan. Jiren himself is beyond time.


Jiren utterly humiliated ToP Arc Goku, even once he unleashed Super Saiyan Blue Kaioken x20. Goku in the Tournament of Power is, lowballed, 500x stronger than he was during the Universe 6 Arc. This is because in the U6 Arc...


Goku was able to match Hit with Blue Kaioken x10...


In the next arc, Goku was able to take Hit down with just Super Saiyan Blue, showing that he got 10x stronger.


Goku was later shown to be on par with Hit in Super Saiyan God, which is 50x weaker than Super Saiyan Blue as a lowball.


This is because Super Saiyan Blue is the Super Saiyan form of Super Saiyan God, and Super Saiyan is a 50x multiplier.

So Jiren is stronger than a Goku that's 500x stronger than he was in the Universe 6 Arc. Universe 6 Arc Goku had three years of training on top of absorbing the power of Super Saiyan God into his base form, which was strong enough to destroy Universe 7.




Universe 7 is composed of several universe sized structures with their own space-times, but I'll lowball it to being a single universe for this.

Overall: Baseline Universal = BoG Arc Base Goku < (Three years of training) U6 Arc Goku < (10x) FT Arc Goku < (50x) ToP Arc Goku < Jiren


Jiren, while not even in his limit breaker state, was capable of killing a God of Destruction on par with Beerus with his aura alone.
Last edited: 8 mo 6 d ago.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman I'm actually annoyed how you completely ignored the advantages that Darkseid has and how you didn't show Jiren having anything to counter them.

Once again, Darkseid can manipulate matter. He changed Miracle Mister Soap to mud, turned Slo-bo to stone, dissipated Wildfire's energy form in quanta, incinerated Kalibak with a touch, and made a ship bigger than New York State. So what good will it do for Jiren to fire ki blasts at him when Darkseid can just manipulate the matter from them?

Need a reminder on Darkseid's Omega Beams? They can pass through physical barriers, find his target, erase someone from existence, create force fields, tamper with advanced technology, hit intangible beings, and send others through space and time. Has Jiren ever displayed a resistance to existence erasure? No!

How is transcending time any better than someone who can teleport, can go 87 duodecillion times the speed of light, and literally become nigh-omnipresent as he exists within everyone along with being at the core of all things?

Want me to prove to you Darkseid's multiversal and at the very least multi-universal? He's beaten Alan Scott with the multiversal green,taken a multiversal punch from him, and consumed universes.
Last edited: 8 mo 6 d ago.
LordTracer
LordTracer 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren You mean the single advantage of intelligence you gave? I addressed that, so...

Ki blasts aren't Jiren's primary method of attack. He uses his physicals far more, or he just glares. Unless Darkseid can see Jiren's glare coming (which is unlikely, because Jiren is faster than time), he's not going to be countering that with matter manip. Plus ki makes it so you can overcome hax via pure power. For example, the video of which is above, Jiren overcame Hit's hax via being stronger than him.


Another example, the VASTLY WEAKER Vegetto was able to continue fighting despite being turned into candy by Buuhan.

The fact that you think Jiren doesn't resist existence erasure tells me you haven't watched much or any of Dragon Ball Super. Jiren is stronger than Gods of Destruction. What's the signature attack of a God of Destruction? That's right, the Hakai! And what does the Hakai do? Ah, yes, it erases the target from existence and even destroys their soul on top of that! And people weaker than Jiren have explicitly tanked the Hakai.




Freeza, Goku and Vegeta were all shown tanking the Hakai.

Because transcending time means your speed is immeasurable. You could be vigintillions of times faster than light, but your speed is still measurable. If you transcend time, you basically break the speed formula by removing the T from S = D/T. Teleportation matters... why? Jiren already fought teleportation users. Twice. Both Goku and Hit have teleportation, Jiren slapped both of them casually. Show me where Darkseid has ever used his nigh-omnipresence in a combat scenario, and then we can talk.

That Alan Scott stuff is New 52. That consuming universes can of yours is also New 52. I don't recall it ever being decided that this was about composite Darkseid avatars v. Jiren. But y'know what, lemme explain why even if you were allowed composite Darkseid avatars, Jiren still slaps.

As I explained earlier, Super Saiyan God Goku in Battle of Gods was universal. That means he's finite 4-D. Prior to going Super Saiyan God, Goku was only galaxy level, aka finite 3-D. That means Super Saiyan God amped Goku by two levels of infinity (finite 3-D => infinite 3-D => finite 4-D). Goku absorbed this into his base form, making his base finite 4-D. So, going Super Saiyan God again would make Goku finite 5-D, because finite 4-D => infinite 4-D => finite 5-D. And that's in the RoF Saga alone. Then remember how Goku trained for three years on top of that, then got 500x stronger before the ToP. That means Jiren is far above someone that is 500x baseline 5-D. Being multiversal is simply infinite 4-D. So even if you used composite Darkseid avatars, hell, even if you used True Form Darkseid, Jiren. Still. Bodies.

And before you attempt to reiterate how I supposedly only look at a character's physicals, actually know how Jiren operates. Jiren steamrolls his opponents through his physicals. That's it. He's even done so to people that are quite intelligent, such as Vegeta.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman I literally showed you Darkseid being nigh-omnipresent within everyone along with being at the core of all things.

Again, he's beaten Alan Scott with the multiversal green,taken a multiversal punch from him, and consumed universes.

Stop f***ing assuming that I haven't watched Dragon Ball Super. Of course I watched it, but I also know what Darkseid's capable of. And no, you didn't address the fact that Darkseid can erase someone from existence.

"Ki makes you overcome any hax?"What kind of a BS statement is that? Is there even a shred of evidence to prove that? You mean to tell me that if Darkseid just incinerated Jiren with a touch, he'd come back from the dead? I don't think so.
Last edited: 8 mo 6 d ago.
LordTracer
LordTracer 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Did you just like... not read my last comment? I literally acknowledged that. I asked you to show me where he's used that IN COMBAT. You can have all the abilities you want, but if you are incapable of using them IN A FIGHT, then they mean nothing in a versus match.

"For the last goddamn time" You literally mentioned this for the first time in your LAST COMMENT. Are you just impatient or something? And I ALREADY ADDRESSED THIS. That is NEW 52 Darkseid, and I went over why even if New 52 Darkseid feats were allowed, IT'S STILL BENEATH JIREN.

You make it very difficult to tell that you've watched it when you claim Jiren doesn't resist existence erasure, Goku isn't universal, etc. I literally did address them. I addressed intelligence, matter manipulation, existence erasure, Darkseid being multiversal (which isn't an advantage because Jiren is beyond that), the Omega Beams, transmutation, I have addressed all of that. Or did you just not read my last comments? Quite frankly, it seems like you aren't reading them, because you haven't once contested any of the scaling I've given for Jiren. If anyone is "not f***ing listening" here, it's you.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman I didn't say anything about Goku not being universal. And you didn't explain to me how Jiren would resist all of what I just said. You merely stated that weaker people resisted existence erasure and having ki makes you overcome any has.

I'm really starting to think you hate DC when it comes to Goku vs Superman themed battles, because in my opinion, you're just downplaying Darkseid.

[Url=https://imgur.com/a/ZxDlc32]Time's[/url] not the only thing Darkseid can manipulate. He can also control space, weather, and even creation.
Last edited: 8 mo 6 d ago.
LordTracer
LordTracer 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Do I need to go and find where you have explicitly said that you think Goku isn't universal? And yeah, I did explain how he would. Ki users can overcome hax through being more powerful than the person using the hax. I said this already.

How is this Goku v. Superman themed...? And I like DC more than Dragon Ball, so...
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Maybe I said Goku isn't universal, but it certainly wasn't on this battle. You saying that hax can be overcome with ki doesn't make any sense. Ki can be hax too, y'know, so it's not like you'd have to use something like brute strength to break a time stop.
LordTracer
LordTracer 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren I never said it was on this battle, though...? How does it not make sense? Vegetto overcame transmutation via being stronger than Buuhan, the person using the transmutation. Jiren overcame time manipulation via being stronger than Hit, the time manipulator. Vegeta overcame existence and soul erasure via being stronger than Toppo, the caster of said hax. Ki users overcome hax via raw strength. It's incredibly simple.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Bah, I'm beat and it's past the time I usually go to sleep. Why don't we continue this some other time? You did well in this debate and I gotta say, nobody's ever given me quite a challenge like you did. I feel like you even helped me improve my debating skills. You're a pretty excellent debater, and I respect that.
Last edited: 8 mo 6 d ago.
LordTracer
LordTracer 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Well, thank you. You're quite good as well, but if I may give one suggestion for DC: make sure you keep your feats to the proper era.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Hey, thanks. You have a good night.
Last edited: 8 mo 6 d ago.
EmptyHand
EmptyHand 8 mo 5 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman @Joe the feats you listed out for darkseid are his true form, and akhil mentioned avatar
EmptyHand
EmptyHand 8 mo 5 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman Also the mordru that darkseid defeated was heavily weakened, by feats mordru makes darkseid his b****
LuciferMorningstar
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman @Joe You apparently read none of those scans you posted.
This was pre crisis Mordru, the weakest version & on top of that he was HEAVILY HEAVILY weakened, so was Darkseid yes, but Mordru was in a state of almost dying, then it being his weakest version too. TFDS needed prep to absorb his magic, and the same to Time Trapper, wow so impressive.

TFDS said he needed the ALE to crack the multiverse & that is what he did in Final Crisis, then TFDS literally did that on an already weakened, dying multiverse how impressive.
The Bleed is just blood flowing through the Universes, it is not dimensional at all. It is just some elixir. Then you missed also it states the Bleed ROTATES THROUGH THE 5D. Which means 5d >>> Bleed.

Darkseid never created those realities, those are not even realities, they are scenarios somebody goes through when in the Omega Sanction, scenarios of torture and death. Nice lie again.

Then you ignore that Pre Crisis Supergirl later on whooped darkseid his ass with Superman & then you are ignoring Supergirl again had Superman his help, mostly fighting against Black Starr.

Other scans show him failing, his own Omega Beams were taken by Superman, Doomsday, by Spectre etc etc so many beings took them no problem. Even Powergirl did so what? Wonder Woman deflects them literally.

Bomb that ripped existence apart? Sounds like a Universal bomb, wowieee.
Spectre took the beams no diff & one shotted Darkseid after.

Time collapsed due to how important darkseid was to reality as concept of evil, not due to his power at all as he cant even do that power wise as shown, he needs ale to crack the multiverse in FC, needs to infect the source to even cause any time rippery. He never has done it with his power.

Takion is weak, Takion lost to many beings.
Last one just shows him able to use avatars during being locked in the wall like a *****.
Rest are Universal feats either or again out of context.
You proven he has past versions, and again due to what he is, not power. Aka a chain reaction.
His beams got taken by fodders as proven.

**And here's another thing, Darkseid's countless of times smarter than Jiren. Darkseid regularly has draws in chess matches against Eclipso, can remember events from erased timelines, turned Mars into an Apokolips copy, made a machine to enter the Source, built a spaceship larger than the state of New York, and manipulated people like Mary Marvel into turning evil again, Captain Marvel into making him self-doubt himself, and even Orion into killing himself in the Source and poisoning it. From what that tells you, Darkseid could manipulate Jiren into killing himself or even doubting himself.**

Did you even read any of those stories? Weak post crisis Eclipso, knowing events of timelines is also what Superman does & even Barry Allen. It just means they kept their memory as established, their origin and character still got changed/retconned.
Darkseid manipulated Orion to kill Darkseid aka allowing himself to get killed so the source gets corrupted. Made a machine to enter the source? Did you read the story? He needed Highfather to enter the source wall, let alone the source. Your scan is of when Darkseid made a machine to twist the Source, nice brain feat I agree, but this is not a prep fight so useless.

Ignoring also that Darkseid literally said power wise, he cant even enter the source wall (true form), and needs Highfather his knowledge to do so (do it with him only, alone cant do ****). Shown when he tried & got stuck to the wall like a fly with glue.

Now to you last paragraph and that made me even reply to your worthless wannabe attempt.
The "MULTIVERSAL GREEN HUR DUR" you are aware that the Green in that story was always stated just the multi planet level green, connected through and with all earths only. One multiverse statement against numerous before & after more consistent multi planet level scans, ignoring Alan did not even control the green nor knew what it can bring.
That one attack made Dorkyseid almost knocked out & needed 5 pages to return again.
Then ignoring core of all things is just Darkseid his own ego self statement on how important he is.

And you shown a scan of Constantine tricking Darkseid, making the Universe seem dead, Darkseid literally did nothing there but get tricked by Constantine. Darkseid in the story killed ONE UNIVERSE, which was done AFTER TIME. Needed literally time just to destroy a UNIVERSE. Wanted to destroy another one, but got tricked by John Constantine. Then what happened? AM did the same planet by planet & DIDNT EVEN FINISH OFF HIS UNIVERSE. I have scans for all of those things, it is sad to see how you use outta context **** just to **** Darkseid, not having read the actual context nor stories of it.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 4 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman @LuciferMorningstar Your comment literally put me to sleep. You could've just given a brief synopsis of everything you said I got wrong in no more than 500 words rather than just typing an essay filled with insults, smart-a**.
Last edited: 8 mo 4 d ago.
LuciferMorningstar
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman It was a half assed paragraph @Joe

But it addresses all the wannabe bullshit you used lol. Don't **** Darkseid to what he is not supposed to be. Superman solos
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 4 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman You're damn straight it was half-assed!

At least I provided links to the "wannabe bullshit" I used while you just typed a long-ass essay of nothing but insults.

Y'know, if you're gonna debunk ignorance, at least try to back up your claims with scans in an intellectual way instead of being an ignorant scrote.

Now you have a nice day...dumb-ass.
Last edited: 8 mo 4 d ago.
LuciferMorningstar
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman You provided outta context scans & I gave context to all your feats you ignorant lil suzie.
What do you want proof for? Tell me each stuff you want proof for & I will get it.

Insults? I did not even insult you that much, I mostly addressed Darkseid or insulted Darkseid lol.
You clearly did not read my paragraph. Now for what point do you want proof? I will get it gladly for a ****** like you.

I EVEN SAID I HAVE THE SCANS, YOU JUST HAVE TO ASK FOR THEM ******.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 4 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman U mad, bro? Lol. No need to throw a hissy fit, you lil scrote. And as I can see now, you are insulting me more than before. Wow, way to contradict yourself. Thought you were smarter than that. Until you can be a more courteous devil, you may have the privilege of showing me some scans.
Last edited: 8 mo 4 d ago.
LuciferMorningstar
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman @Joe
Have you read any of the stories you presented?

Anyway what scans do you want? I will give you all of them.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 4 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Are you composed? Good. That wasn't so hard.

Now you may present your scans in a civil and disciplined manner.
Last edited: 8 mo 4 d ago.
LuciferMorningstar
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman What scans do you need? Just name me the points & I will get them
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 8 mo 1 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman @LuciferMorningstar You're joking, right? You had literally two days to present your scans and yet you're still here asking me which ones I want? That's just sadly embarrassing; you aren't as smart as you sound. It doesn't take a genius or rocket science to understand the meaning of a few sentences. And since you want the basic gist of what you failed to grasp, here's what it is:

All the scans to the half-assed paragraph of "wannabe bullshit" you typed.

So, get to searching and find those scans, or stop wasting my f***ing time on a thread you weren't even involved in!!
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 7 mo 27 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman @LordTracer Okay, let me go back a little bit. IIRC, you said ki users can overcome hax, right? And did you not also say that for users with enormous power levels?
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 7 mo 15 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman @LordTracer So basically, I could kill Jiren by doing something like stabbing him in the heart or shooting him in the head and he'd still live with the help of his ki? Yeah, that makes sense.
LordTracer
LordTracer 7 mo 15 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Uh... number one, you can't do either of those things to Jiren unless he's *extremely* off-guard. And even then, you'd at best annoy him. And when did I say ki can be used like that? It lets people overcome hax, not being murdered lmao. Although Goku has shown the ability to resurrect with his ki, so...
LuciferMorningstar
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman https://2.bp.blogspot.com/wTYWDP4NIPzGRt7l2e0A0c1zoURcMR30387ZZss-L9K4k8rZtuSTA0eDjwcmvqRWF5NEa3OBJWYn=s1600

Here is proof the Ale cracked the multiverse.

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/5MSZYQA0NeY1s4pfqBNW-EGNLCLoUaOUu-I5KWa3ITS5pHpgXdgKrpv2VahJ1hAuOTBmKJWG9JRO=s1600

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/DP_EniBjpucqtVR75LUDOBQsb9uic1l7x2UjJ0WOQ1bB4yNhDlgAwrk7gjifwTPmE9EwZJNtdJZi=s0

Here is proof the multiverse was dying before TFDS did anything.
And was already in a bad position.

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/aUR6MfDqpsakjdmAkOXyHn1rvkodzP0Pz1_E2hQ8G5CLMTb1gcS6VxSFfZjJHR1wSjUBoUJhy6BsyA=s0
Here is Darkseid admitting the multiverse is beyond him.

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/q6sBcsw3Om8-lz7jaUKZssBcLDGL6n4CFuRP4liIMWKuHSIQaVZ6zw9UorKN20KYq4YosCaBO3mL=s0
Here is proof that to affect the multiverse in DC or **** with it you only have to destroy earth.
Earth = Universe connection, aka any planet level guy can cause a multiversal chain reaction.

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/cWF3L1daI-Ds7yYfBvSn5p1OEs4VRtXfVevPjTXdSyVVaO51R-uJw2DsP4BGtS9fTCtzmMR8M40xUMjv9qgThNbaEV37r6OVwNPjI5piWHJbiQUsKGuc32-XAW9Ie29j6ef9pJYhOg=s0

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/UPbeY-J-sCs0qG-sa9wZgK1adUeJ-JoBwGR7qrVTE-LVTfp4ppltI2zEFX87IomXlqqwFSOoyLEGi_q09QV9RaepmRz6IDWbwcm4o3144KbReMdqvsxqmz14m9jDEp_7xioafRtzUw=s0
That is what AM did too, cuck planets to crack the multiverse open.

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/ewX2_knOlKRJRfDihmJP03sgBiDKzZJOrsNKJUgVpE7ndSE1U8zJOhxi2CJkrEoedrA0vQO1y7OVPvXa66O2o9sG2MXIfBN9qGSfkTryD4PjrspSwSiyB0Z1u9EvtztEpZ8nFmsp_w=s0
Batman here while on The Mobius Chair, backs up AM all he did was suck planets life energies, nothing more for his crack.
Didnt even finish the goddam planet smh.

http://i.imgur.com/kmHQqxw.png
http://i.imgur.com/vxAAyN3.jpg
Here proof Alan Scott never had the green, and never knew how to utilize it. Also power of earth stated again.

http://i.imgur.com/cNaD6Uj.png
Power Girl hurt that same Darkseid.

https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/11119/111196008/4762037-4588065-earth%2B2%2B-%2Bworld%2527s%2Bend%2B%25282014-%2529%2B026-022%5B1%5D.jpg
Here Alan Scott literally knocked out Darkseid for 6 pages with a lucky punch backed by the green finally.

Nowhere in the comic was it stated the punch was universe/multiverse busting. He had the power of all the GREEN IN THE MULTIVERSE. Each universe has their own Earth and each Earth has their own Green. There are 52 universes, 52 green. Is Swamp Thing a planet buster? Either way that's nowhere near universe busting.

Hence Alan Scott had the power of ALL EARTHS, not multiversal power at all as shown by my scans.

https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/11127/111279017/5477424-rcubrh.jpg
Once more shown only MULTI PLANET power.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/541460549725323264/660080105657466900/Screenshot_2019-12-27-16-51-47-98.png

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/541460549725323264/660080104873000971/Screenshot_2019-12-27-16-52-09-47.png

Here proof Constantine made earth vanish, earth = Universe, Darkseid did not absorb any Universe there.
It was his vision getting tricked by Constantine.

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/ZUMoK33sFMhMF9abD7UxgEStKaZQCS7vCwm4Ogc-ZN12jPZeDLYaU9hVIA8qDsZP7aWkwrCayDyoi8cGs6Z5kzFZUJwJySeVCLTtFlCcb_Ln2nS5RoxiVY3SlE8AaAH2KDvdrky2=s0

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/kuFV6vKXJZrBpBrn9Bfd2QSPVuwgcIx9iL7FhlaXU8AROajKzKvRp58DQIQfC9CuSlVKyR5MoNJFHt8CR8qOw8tpAGWYXO2bfAq89kE3BIUOWD8jYuYJ0KKAVtONBrMAU_eQbsUz=s0
LuciferMorningstar
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman @Joe there you go, what more do you want proof of?
LuciferMorningstar
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman @joe
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 7 mo 5 h 45 m
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman @Lucifer Well, it's about time you provided scans. Took you long enough, but at least your links aren't broken or expired. If you wanna act smart, cut the insults next time.
Last edited: 6 mo 30 d ago.
ManofPower
ManofPower 6 mo 19 d
Superman vs Jiren
2 year member
Jiren What The F... Jiren does not beat Darkseid, he does however easily beat Superman.
ManofPower
ManofPower 6 mo 19 d
Superman vs Jiren
2 year member
Jiren As a former moderator I am ordering the both of you to stop, let's not leave a hostile mess for @Galactus when he returns.
ManofPower
ManofPower 6 mo 19 d
Superman vs Jiren
2 year member
Jiren @Holy_Joe, you cannot force someone to apologize, just accept that. Lord Tracer is stubborn AF, XD I only won like two debates against him.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 6 mo 19 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Okay, @MoP. We get it. How about I just put this ordeal behind us and call it even?
Mxyzptlk
Mxyzptlk 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman Does jiren has feats that make his billion , trillions than faster than light?
show 8 replies
LordTracer
LordTracer 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Better. He has feats that put him beyond time itself.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 6 mo 19 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Beyond embarrassing is what your character puts himself at, @Tracer. Jiren should've just instantly blitzed everyone he fought in the Tournament of Power if he really could transcend time, but he got his ass kicked by MUI Goku, Frieza, and 17, who aren't even close to that speed. He's nothing more than the laughing stock of Universe 11.
Last edited: 6 mo 19 d ago.
LordTracer
LordTracer 6 mo 19 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Christ, you really cannot get over this, can you? And you're just proving you're either ignoring context or just don't know s h i t about Dragon Ball and have a hateboner for it, and I'm inclined to think the latter. Don't you have better s h i t to do than try to debate about a show you clearly dislike and clearly do not care enough to learn the actual context or pay basic attention to the things that happen to it?

#1: There is no "MUI Goku." Goku did not master Ultra Instinct. Only the Angels have. And Jiren was fighting on par with UI Goku for a majority of the fight, which you'd know if you, y'know, watched the anime.
#2: 17 and Freeza were both getting CLAPPED by a WEAKENED Jiren, what type of lying ass s h i t are you trying to pull lol. Jiren tanked several attacks from 17 with no damage whatsoever and was beating Golden Freeza's ass beforehand.
#3: UI Goku absolutely does transcend time, as do Freeza and 17. You can't just make the assumption that they don't. *You especially don't have the authority to make such a claim.*
#3: Jiren is literally the strongest member of the Universe 11 and the strongest person in that universe apart from Marcarita. Once again, showing you have very little knowledge on this show and should stop making claims about it.
Last edited: 6 mo 19 d ago.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 6 mo 19 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Quit being so hostile and cut the insults, kid. You're just really not good at making others feel bad. And there's really no reason for you to use that name especially when you don't believe in him. Y'know, I have a lot of respect for you, and I really think you're an excellent debater, so I keep you on my favorites. But seeing as how you lashed out on me like that, I'm starting to have second thoughts. If you're gonna bother replying to me, you better do it in a civil and polite manner. And I don't hate Dragon Ball, per se; I actually enjoy it seeing as how it's the show that inspired other series like One Piece and Naruto to exist, which you probably wouldn't have heard about. I just don't think Goku can actually beat Superman, so...

Of course I know that the angels have Ultra Instinct. How do you think Whis is able to handle Beerus and give Goku and Vegeta a hard time hitting him?

Weakened, yes, but utterly humiliated by Goku, when he should've had no problem blitzing him in his Ultra Instinct state. Simply saying that he transcends time but shows that he got humiliated by UI Goku isn't really convincing me that he's beating Superman.

You haven't even stated that Goku transcends time. No, you've literally been talking about Jiren this entire time. I'm not making a claim at all. If anyone is, it's you. I'm just throwing in my opinion and you literally have a problem with it.

Saying I have little knowledge of these things doesn't mean you're any better. I use common sense and logic along with what I know about a specific topic as my debating skills.
Last edited: 6 mo 19 d ago.
LordTracer
LordTracer 6 mo 19 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren I am not being hostile at all. I'm simply being firm, as you have on NUMEROUS occasions bothered me on Dragon Ball stuff. And why are you assuming I don't believe in Jesus when I do... Actually get over this, stop bothering me about it, and stop making claims about a series you don't have expertise in, and maybe I won't have to tell you off.

I didn't say you HATE it. I said, based on how you act in relation to it, that you dislike it. And I literally like Naruto more than Dragon Ball and plan on reading One Piece after I finish Bleach so... nice baseless assumptions you got there.

If you knew that, then you wouldn't have used the term 'MUI' in relation to Goku. Because he has not mastered Ultra Instinct and he isn't even close to doing so. And Whis is able to handle Beerus because he's an Angel and that's their job. Not solely because of Ultra Instinct.

Goku did not humiliate Jiren lmao, Jiren was fighting evenly with UI Goku and no, Jiren does not blitz UI Goku just because he transcends time. Those two points do not correlate in any way whatsoever. You do realize that UI Goku is the most powerful character in the series up until the Angels, right...?

Your "opinion" is not an opinion. It's a claim. You claimed UI Goku is not even close to having speed that transcends time, which is false because he scales to Jiren. Also you're the one that pinged me, champ, don't act like I came in here randomly.

Considering how I am actually knowledgeable on this series... And please explain how "common sense and logic" told you that Jiren is the laughingstock of Universe 11 despite the fact that he's clearly the strongest one there.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 6 mo 19 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman No, you are being absolutely hostile. You swore at me, insulted me and specifically said to me, and I quote "And you're just proving you're either ignoring context or just don't know s h i t about Dragon Ball and have a hateboner for it". That proves to me otherwise. You are absolutely hostile right here, you

Okay, bet. I do research and I recently found this on the Dragon Ball wiki.
Goku has been cited as an inspiration for such protagonists like Usagi Tsukino, Monkey D. Luffy, Naruto Uzumaki, and Zatch Bell from the Sailor Moon, One Piece, Naruto, and Zatch Bell series respectively.
In episode 6 of Naruto SD, "Rock Lee and His Ninja Pals", the card Tenten draws out of the box says "A thrilling conclusion where seeing your best friend killed causes you to snap and awakens your latent powers?!" Shizune states that it is straight out of Dragon Ball, referencing the Frieza Saga when Krillin gets killed and Goku turns into a Super Saiyan for the first time.

I don't really think it would matter to you because you don't think of the wiki as evidence. Who's making the baseless assumptions now, you hostile freak?

Y'know, wherever I look on the Internet, there's someone that said "Mastered Ultra Instinct", and it led me to believe that Goku actually did master it.

So what if I made a claim? You literally said that Goku transcends time and you haven't proved it. Maybe you have and I didn't take a look at it. I'm sorry that I have a life here.

Stop calling me "champ" and other things like "mate" here, kid. I don't consider you a friend at all after the way you acted.
Last edited: 6 mo 19 d ago.
LordTracer
LordTracer 6 mo 19 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren If you wanna treat firmness as hostility, then that just sounds like a you problem tbh. You also ignored how you do continuously bother me on this and keep bringing up debates from the Stone Age. And what exactly is the problem with swearing? I use it for emphasis.

What exactly is that supposed to prove? Also for someone that apparently doesn't like hostility, you were quick to whip out the insult on that one, weren't you? Pot calling the kettle black much? Also no response to how you assumed for literally no reason that I didn't know about Naruto and One Piece, n o i c e.

And there's your problem. You're using the Internet over what actually happened in the series itself.

I literally did prove it lol. UI Goku could keep up with Jiren, who transcends time, which I proved the last time you bothered me about this.

What does you considering me a friend have to do with anything, exactly?

Now, if you wouldn't mind, stop pinging me about month old debates and making random assumptions about me. It's quite bothersome.
Last edited: 6 mo 19 d ago.
HolyJoe
HolyJoe 6 mo 19 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman @LordTracer I'm still not happy about how you replied to me. So, I'd really like an apology.
Ri
Rivera05 8 mo 6 d
Superman vs Jiren
not voted 3 Vote Left For Jiren
BlotskyA
BlotskyA 8 mo 10 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
not voted Superman solos DBZ except for Beerus
show 2 replies
DevyEZ
DevyEZ 8 mo 10 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman Beerus is not even the most powerful character in the Dragon Ball verse.
LordTracer
LordTracer 8 mo 10 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren *facepalm*
#1: Beerus isn't even in Dragon Ball Z. He's in Dragon Ball Super.
#2: Jiren is FAR stronger than Beerus.
#3: Superman isn't even getting past Buuhan.
jirenkillz
jirenkillz 8 mo 11 d
Superman vs Jiren
Jiren Superman has too many kids and fanboys, Jiren could oneshot at his full power.
jirenkillz
jirenkillz 8 mo 11 d
Superman vs Jiren
Jiren *stewie's meme with the gun in the mouth*
Atomic_lantern
Atomic_lantern 8 mo 11 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Jiren Ew
Ri
Rivera05 8 mo 11 d
Superman vs Jiren
not voted 10 Ben 10 (Cartoon Network)
9 Jiren (Dragon Ball Super)
8 Goku Black (Dragon Ball Super)
7 Spawn (Image Comics)
6 Shin Megami Tensei Dante (Devil May Cry)
5 Melkor (Lord Of The Rings)
4 Unicron (Transformers)
3 Broly (Dragon Ball Super)
2 Sonic (Archie Comics)
1 Dracula (Castlevania)
show 2 replies
Dark_Wing
Dark_Wing 8 mo 11 d
Superman vs Jiren
2 year member
Superman What's that list a ranking of?
LordTracer
LordTracer 8 mo 11 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Stop posting random things on battle pages.
Ri
Rivera05 8 mo 11 d
Superman vs Jiren
not voted Yeah. C'mon Superman. I Want Jiren To Take Wins. Because I Will Give Top 10 Anime, Cartoon Video, Games, And Comic Characters Who Can Defeat Superman
ThanosCar
ThanosCar 8 mo 15 d
Superman vs Jiren
Jiren Jiren shakes off universe busting attacks with ease. He glanced Vegeta's Final Flash out of existence. He surpassed time itself. This is a stomp in Jiren's favor.
Jongensoden
Jongensoden 1 y 3 mo 4 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman superman
SpiderBitten
SpiderBitten 1 y 4 mo 26 d
Superman vs Jiren
2 year member
Superman Jiren was beaten in the tournament of power by Frieza and Goku. Superman killed Goku twice in Death Battle. And a lot of people agree on here, that Superman beats Goku (65.7% as of 6/30/19) Superman can get to the pace of the Flash and beat him easily, He broke Green Lantern Energy Constructs, Held a BLACK HOLE in his hand, Moved the earth around many times, bench-pressed the entire earth for five days, and fought his way through the big bang! Who knows what Jiren could do. Oh yeah, and Superman fought an alternate version of himself, and the very punches cause ripples in Time and Space itself. Did we see THAT in T.O.P.? I didn't think so.
show 1 reply
LordTracer
LordTracer 1 y 4 mo 26 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren Wow, that is some horrendous logic.
1. You're completely ignoring the context of Jiren's defeat. Jiren was totally exhausted and nowhere near at full power.
2. Death Battle is not evidence and they've been debunked numerous times, especially on Goku v. Superman. Actual feats and scaling say Superman gets bodied by Goku.
3. Jiren utterly dominated Super Saiyan Blue Kaioken x20 Goku, who was casually capable of wiping out numerous universes at that point. Far more impressive than a measly black hole. Oh, and Superman fighting through the Big Bang? That's Pre-Crisis, so it can't be used here. Causing ripples in time and space? Please, Buuhan was doing that by screaming alone. Jiren surpassed time completely.
XSegaTeamPhilosophyX
XSegaTeamPhilosophyX 1 y 7 mo 25 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Superman Superman puts a nice hole in his impostor's body.
Last edited: 4 mo 22 d ago.
show 2 replies
LordTracer
LordTracer 1 y 7 mo 10 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Jiren "Imposter"
- Literally nothing about them is similar except for having red in their costume.
10earthquakes
10earthquakes 1 y 7 mo 10 d
Superman vs Jiren
2 year member
Jiren And that they're aliens.
Deathstroke4U
Deathstroke4U 1 y 8 mo 14 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Jiren Who voted superman
show 2 replies
Mohamed
Mohamed 1 y 27 d
Superman vs Jiren
3 year member
Superman Me.
Kr
KrMaster 10 mo 4 d
Superman vs Jiren
Superman Me
SpiderBitten
SpiderBitten 1 y 4 mo 26 d
Superman vs Jiren
2 year member
Superman Do you even think about the OP feats that Superman has done? Superman can get to the pace of the Flash and beat him easily, He broke Green Lantern Energy Constructs, Held a BLACK HOLE in his hand, Moved the earth around many times, bench-pressed the entire earth for five days, and fought his way through the big bang! Don't assume that Jiren would win easily, Think!
Ch
Chopperon 1 y 6 mo 23 d
Superman vs Jiren
1 year member
Jiren Well Jiren actually did shake the world of void which is infinite, so I don't underdtand why you Say that, the feat is invalid, If anyone want to learn more about Jiren I would reccomend them to wach Chuck The Cyber Cuck channel on YouTube.

Voting feed

Taurus
Superman wins!
Dilorenzom
Superman wins!
pedrofOMAIOR
Jiren wins!
Ralkero
Jiren wins!
MoNsTeR
Superman wins!
Prion
Jiren wins!
Dhruv
Jiren wins!
ph
Jiren wins!
Supe4me
Superman wins!
Giugi76
Jiren wins!
dog
Jiren wins!
XSegaTeamPhilosophyX
Superman wins!
Lovecraft
Jiren wins!
Uzumaki_Naruto
Superman wins!
Lapis_Lazuli
Superman wins!
Nz13
Superman wins!
Aries
Superman wins!
DarkProdigy
Superman wins!
Mr_Incognito
Superman wins!
ManofPower
Jiren wins!
Z_man_the_overpowered
Superman wins!
Dusk_Pikachu
Superman wins!
HolyJoe
Superman wins!
Alien_X
Jiren wins!
Yatharth
Superman wins!
mi
Jiren wins!
DB_hustler
Jiren wins!
He
Jiren wins!
Michealdem17
Jiren wins!
Lord_Of_Apokolips
Superman wins!
Al
Jiren wins!
Oblivion
Superman wins!
DevyEZ
Superman wins!
LuciferMorningstar
Superman wins!
Breaker
Superman wins!
AkhilPDX
Jiren wins!
Jakcj
Superman wins!
Ma
Superman wins!
jirenkillz
Jiren wins!
IamMoonKnight
Superman wins!
Scarlet_Witch_Stomps
Superman wins!
EmptyHand
Superman wins!
azathothstomps
Jiren wins!
Laserblue
Jiren wins!
spectredominates
Jiren wins!
RedEyeJoe
Jiren wins!
ThanosCar
Jiren wins!
CsBat01
Jiren wins!
Mxyzptlk
Superman wins!
shaneherald
Jiren wins!
Alienx
Jiren wins!
Kr
Superman wins!
Vi
Superman wins!
Sa
Superman wins!
Eydaxor
Superman wins!
Shadowatti
Superman wins!
bi
Superman wins!
Dark_Wing
Superman wins!
Jongensoden
Superman wins!
Xx
Jiren wins!
Atomic_lantern
Jiren wins!
_s
Jiren wins!
SpiderBitten
Superman wins!
DeanDinosaur6
Superman wins!
ra
Jiren wins!
LuiTheDawg
Superman wins!
Hurricano
Superman wins!
HReaper
Jiren wins!
Ch
Jiren wins!
NorrinRadd
Jiren wins!
Lantern_Von_Doom
Superman wins!
Deathstroke4U
Jiren wins!
Bane333
Jiren wins!
ta
Jiren wins!
Dc
Superman wins!
Spaghettiboat
Jiren wins!
LordTracer
Jiren wins!
TheSuspect666
Superman wins!
Soulcollecter57
Jiren wins!
windshadow
Superman wins!
Sw
Superman wins!
JuggarNot
Superman wins!
Mohamed
Superman wins!
MisterB
Jiren wins!
ThorGodOfThunder94
Jiren wins!
He
Superman wins!
TheNemianLion
Superman wins!
Akephalos
Superman wins!
Creature99
Superman wins!
remy94
Superman wins!
Ay
Jiren wins!
10earthquakes
Jiren wins!