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Aleazlllll
12 months member
103K
Team The Butcher why green goblin is here
Aleazlllll
12 months member
103K
Gamora agreed
MoNsTeR
29 months member
3.3M
i did like trailer
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Gamora Gamora curbstomps
Doomsday
5 months member
11.4K
@Monster what do you think about outlast trials?
Aleazlllll
12 months member
103K
Scarlet Witch (True Darkhold) wanda absorbed chthon
Sofia08
0 months member
140
Zatanna (Otherkind) What make you think she can stomp her? Can you prove you say?
2099
23 months member
6.3K
Team Unicron Galactus and Primus duos
Sofia08
0 months member
140
Neutral Jack Kirby separated himself from TOAA and made The Fulcrum his form in the comics, I think The Fulcrum and Excelsior Hulk have the potential to be Supreme Beings in the Marvel verse after TOAA was killed by Thanos.
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
not voted Why you always make one sided variations
Sofia08
0 months member
140
Featherine Augustus Aurora (Umineko Verse) I believe Featherine can manipulate the Lovecraft verse and then make it a weapon to kill Azathoth.
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Team Billy Butcher (V24) (The Boys 2019) He can't handle them all at once
Sofia08
0 months member
140
Loki (God Of Stories) The Shaper of World requires Imagination to use its power so I think Loki should be able to defeat the Shaper of World, because Loki might be able to trick him into trapping him into the story.
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Darth Vader Vote variation
Sofia08
0 months member
140
White Phoenix of the Crown White Hot Room >> Far-Shore
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Team Captain Marvel Carol solos
Sofia08
0 months member
140
Zatanna (Otherkind) Stomp? Really

RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Team John Wick (JWU) Predator got killed by weakened cop these guys are just too much for Predator
2099
23 months member
6.3K
The One-Above-All So we have 2 important lines from this comic. The first emphasizes that the presence meeting Lucifer is shaped by external forces. The second says that he is not true form. Based on this information we can conclude 2 different things
1)This avatar is created by true form presence so as he said The true form is external force.
In this case TOA = The presence
2)This avatar is shaped by author's as well as his real form. being avatar does not mean that his true form should be made by real form only.
P.s As this debate can be either way I'll change my vote to neutral and suggest to do same because this is not discussion about the presence only. You didn't say even one argument proving that Presence is more powerful than TOA (We only discussed his relation to external forces and avatars)
Last edited: 8 d ago.
Doomsday
5 months member
11.4K
Me too.
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Team Sentinel (EMCU) It's not really crazy considering most of the characters get one shotted and win only because of Primus
Aleazlllll
12 months member
103K
Thanos hahahaha
MoNsTeR
29 months member
3.3M
both parts were awesome cannot wait 3rd came out
Doomsday
5 months member
11.4K
Yes.
MoNsTeR
29 months member
3.3M
did you finish outlast 2?
Doomsday
5 months member
11.4K
This image was made by me on my PC since I recently finished the entire game and Whistleblower.
Sofia08
0 months member
140
The Presence @2099 The Light itself is just one of the many avatars The Presence have, also has in the scan, not showing The Great Evil Beast but The Great Darkness which is the third strongest being in DC.

and @LadyGaladriel herself is just giving an opinion that has absolutely nothing to do with The Presence, and then you defend her just because she agrees with you even though what she's giving doesn't make any sense where it comes from.
Last edited: 27 d ago.
Aleazlllll
12 months member
103K
Maria Ushiromiya (Umineko Verse) fax
Sofia08
0 months member
140
The Presence "A plea for understanding father? That's grotesque, like that body you've chosen to press up in" that proved that what was in front of him was just an avatar!
Vers05
2 months member
1.9K
Maria Ushiromiya (Umineko Verse) Maria stomps Entire dragon ball
2099
23 months member
6.3K
The One-Above-All Sorry I don't get any proof. can you quote the exact line from the pic that makes me think that he was an avatar.
Vers05
2 months member
1.9K
Witch King Qui gon has the force. Even if he lost his weapon he could still use the force. So battle ends in stalemate or qui gon wins with high diff.
Sofia08
0 months member
140
The Presence and The Presence who spoke to Lucifer himself was "Avatar".

That's enough to provide proof that the External Force is The Presence in its true form because The Presence has been confirmed by The Writer as "God", while "God" itself certainly doesn't have a form that can be described by human reason!
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Scarlet Witch (MCU) That other one is rebooted version
2099
23 months member
6.3K
Scarlet Witch (MCU) Probably because Dark phoenix has new profile and Wanda wins against her
2099
23 months member
6.3K
The One-Above-All Every character is created by someone, but being author's fictional representative and being "shaped by external forces" sounds different.
Sofia08
0 months member
140
The Presence "The Presence was created by The Writer" lol, that's really funny considering The Presence was once present as The Writer in Vertigo comics.
Last edited: 27 d ago.
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Scarlet Witch (MCU) Why is Jean still winning?
Sofia08
0 months member
140
The Presence TOAA is created by The Writer too lol
Aleazlllll
12 months member
103K
Team All-Father Thor strange and thor solos
2099
23 months member
6.3K
The One-Above-All The presence is shaped by external forces, while TOAA is an external force itself.
Last edited: 24 d ago.
2099
23 months member
6.3K
The One-Above-All @Sofia08 Your picture does not prove that the great evil beast meant the presence when he mentioned avatars. As GEB is avatar himself. The words "each of them unaware of their connection to a larger will" was a hint about his relation to Lucifer.
P.s @LadyGaladriel1212 was right.
Unlike TOA, The presence is created by author.
Last edited: 27 d ago.
Aleazlllll
12 months member
103K
BB (Nasuverse) cursed cutting cratter GG
Aleazlllll
12 months member
103K
Doctor Fate Fate stomps
2099
23 months member
6.3K
I suggest you to add more Physical related powers in the list or increase SPS for current ones: "Super strength", "Large size", "Berserk mode", ''Durability'', ''Endurance'' "Godly physiology"... For example, It's unfair that MCU Hulk and Thanos have lower stats than street level wizards who have no chance against them. I know that the class number does not directly determine which character is stronger, but it's weird to see Scarlet witch having 15x higher class than Thor/Superman and 50x higher than Thanos. (live action)
Briefly, something should change in order to establish balance between physically strong and mage user characters.
Last edited: 27 d ago.
Sofia08
0 months member
140
The Presence You loose.
Sofia08
0 months member
140
The Presence That's just Great Darkness and The Light's explanation, no one calls it The Presence, you call me a fanboy but you don't look at yourself and always downgrade The Presence, and for a fanboy like yourself, I'm telling you that The Light is an avatar of The Presence!
achilles
1 months member
412
Team Ikaris (MCU) @Rage444 How TH is superman faster than Ikaris? MCU ikaris is several times faster than the speed of light. He covered 150 million km within a minute
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Captain Marvel Pre Schrodinger Alucard loses
ChaosServant12345
1 months member
1.6K
Ben 10 Who's more overhyped? Let's find out!
ubslucky
24 months member
148K
Kenshiro (Fist Of The North Star) Well, Deadman is already dead I guess...
DormammusEcho75
12 months member
202
no what? γ ͺ⼕卄ㄖ#1749 we can discuss it
ChaosServant12345
1 months member
1.6K
Captain Marvel The fact that people think Alucard actually wins this just proves how overhyped he is.
2099
23 months member
6.3K
Immortals 2011

Last edited: 27 d ago.
ThorTheThunderer
13 months member
1.1K
1. toaa
2. beyonder beyond realm
3. fulcrum
4. toba
5. divine creator
6. gos loki
7. hoi vision
8. hoi nyx
9. cosmic immortal hulk
10. the dreamer
11. man thing (divine creator staff)
12. tiamut
13. astral regulator thanos
14. rune king thor
15. molecule man beyonders powers
Last edited: 11 d ago.
vcowles77
24 months member
124K
Three super cute cats
LadyGaladriel1212
15 months member
10.1K
The One-Above-All @Sofia08 Before existence, there was only a Great Darkness; a single, black infinitude. Within that darkness, however, a single, burning Light was born. As it grew, the darkness screamed, resulting in an imperceptable flaw in the once-immaculate perception of the Light. And in that moment, the cosmos was born.[6]

As "the Voice", the Light created the word and the Omniverse. In the process, it wrote its divine name into all creation on a submolecular level, making the Light present in all things. The I found this online and this proves that he is a created being. The cosmos is being refused as the presence and if this does not convince you (which it obviously wont because you are a fanboy)I done debating since you accused everyone being biased towards him even though it is just the fax.
Sofia08
0 months member
140
Team Wolverine Wolverine solos, Mystique solo in one on one battle
Sofia08
0 months member
140
Mystique Easy for Mystique
Sofia08
0 months member
140
Neutral Harley can't kill her loves
Sofia08
0 months member
140
Thanos (Astral Regulator) Galactus just creates Multi-Eternity while Thanos absorbs all of Marvel verses
2099
23 months member
6.3K
Hi @Ezio @MoNsTeR
could I load my Ustat and connect character to "Zeus" Hub ?
https://www.superherodb.com/zeus/10-51035/
kawhigoat
3 months member
287
Lucifer Morningstar Lucifer > Molecule Man > God Emperor Doom
RavenCraftAG
16 months member
24.7K
Phoenix Father & Mother of Thanos vs Mother of Galactus
Sofia08
0 months member
140
Thor Thor win just because his battle experience
Sofia08
0 months member
140
The Presence TOAA is just an "avatar" of writer/editor/artist, he is not the embodiment of Marvel's founder because Jack Kirby himself prefers The Fulcrum as himself in the comics and Stan Lee prefers Excelsior Hulk over TOAA as himself, also TOAA is now taken over by Al Ewing who will make himself only on par with The Writer (Grant Morrison) which is one aspect of The Presence or what you know better as the External Force.
Sofia08
0 months member
140
The Presence Can you provide Proof or Scan when The Presence uses its true form in the comics? Definitely not, because The Presence himself always uses Avatar as a means to interact with his creations, even during the Vertigo comics that is not his real form!
Sofia08
0 months member
140
The Presence Upvoting may be a biased Marvel fan, also in the scan when Presence says that he was created by an External Force, because The Presence never uses his original form in the comics because the author himself says that he is the embodiment of God who God Himself does not have a physical form like TOAA!

So, External Force = The Presence of God
Peruvianguy
2 months member
820
Kylo Ren Even if a stormtrooper tried to attack him their shots will miss.
LadyGaladriel1212
15 months member
10.1K
The One-Above-All @Sofia08 if that is so than why did I get 2 upvotes, tell them to them as well, he was literarily created by external forces.
Sofia08
0 months member
140
Neutral Could go either way
Sofia08
0 months member
140
Ino Yamanaka Trap her into Illusion
Sofia08
0 months member
140
Tsunade Easy for tsunade
Sofia08
0 months member
140
Neutral This Aizen form maybe could win but still debatable
Sofia08
0 months member
140
The Presence No he is not, stop giving the false argument about The Presence
Last edited: 27 d ago.
ForJustice1324
39 months member
21.6K
Change his name to Smart Hulk
ForJustice1324
39 months member
21.6K
While it's not the best Marvel has done I do enjoy the She-Hulk series very much. The CGI can be off at times but considering it's a series not a movie I can understand why. Tatiana Maslany is funny as She-Hulk and I loved her scenes with Mark Ruffalo as Hulk and their little grudge match in the first episode.
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Scarlet Witch (MCU) I got the wrong cordinates i was trying to get the cordinates to place i usually go walkign around
Mh
8 months member
1.4K
Akuto Sai (IUND) Akuto sai slams no diff
Peruvianguy
2 months member
820
Kirby should be tier 7 not 6.
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Team Scarlet Witch (MCU) @Mandos9452 Agreed
Mandos9452
15 months member
13.1K
Team Scarlet Witch (MCU) Hulk does as well
LadyGaladriel1212
15 months member
10.1K
Witch King @mandos9452 agreed, if this was the movies than Qui-Gon stomps but if we were basing this off the books that the witch king wins by default, QGJ is only winning because people are not knowledgeable on him
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Team Scarlet Witch (MCU) Godzilla solos
Mandos9452
15 months member
13.1K
Witch King I would agree Qui-Gon is more powerful but he literally can't win here. if he stabbed Wk he would lose his weapon and would be injured in doing so. Also its unlikely for him to get ragdolled from being a ghost.
LadyGaladriel1212
15 months member
10.1K
Eru Iluvatar @vcowless77 who is this guy?
LadyGaladriel1212
15 months member
10.1K
The One-Above-All & Eru Iluvatar Both solo
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Captain America (Phoenix Force) Dawg you literally have the dumbest logic on this website like using your logic MCU Hulk would kill DCEU Superman because DCEU Superman was already killed by a mindless raging brute like Hulk
vcowles77
24 months member
124K
not voted Very different types of cosmology scalings
Mandos9452
15 months member
13.1K
Melkor & Kylo Ren Melkor stomps. Varda is the only threat. Ungoliant Ambushed a Weakened Melkor aka At the time known as Morgoth. Who was still likely more powerful or at least as strong as her. Melkor feared Varda because she knew and foresaw his intentions. Not because of her fury(Although she in my opinion the strongest Valar besides Manwe and Melkor) But No Valar could get even close to match melkor who can daunt and intimidate Manwe at his prime.
Last edited: 27 d ago.
Aleazlllll
12 months member
103K
Team Athena (Saint Seiya) hades solos
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Spawn (Modern) (Spawn) I would say Spawn>Rider>Superman
Ny
2 months member
20
Scarlet Witch (MCU) @MoNsTeR He has 1000+ of battle experience but its common knowledge that he’s slow mentally. Wanda has shown to have better battle iq multiple times. Having more experience in battle doesn’t mean that you have good battle iq and he has barely shown that he has
QuandaIe_Dingle
6 months member
1.3K
A human imprisoned him πŸ’€
ubslucky
24 months member
148K
Recca Hanabishi (FoR) Recca also has Phoenix powers...
MaseTheFace
17 months member
19.3K
All Writers I’ve been set up

again πŸ™„
MaseTheFace
17 months member
19.3K
A dog, he’s in my OC list if you wanna see
Aleazlllll
12 months member
103K
Captain America (Phoenix Force) now this is a stomp in steve favour
Aleazlllll
12 months member
103K
Team Great Evil Beast nyarlathotep solos
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Master Chief (Halo 2022) Chief high diffs
Vers05
2 months member
1.9K
Darkseid (True Form) Darkseid IS
MoNsTeR
29 months member
3.3M
not voted you ruined the joke 😭
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Maria Ushiromiya (Umineko Verse) It was 2006 sicko mode didn't exist he was singing message by Nas
MoNsTeR
29 months member
3.3M
not voted tbh i was surprised that darkseid survived so long listening sicko mode superman was singing 😭
Vers05
2 months member
1.9K
Darkseid (True Form) https://07th-expansion.fandom.com/wiki/Maria_Ushiromiya
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Maria Ushiromiya (Umineko Verse) She isn't just a 9 year old girl
Vers05
2 months member
1.9K
Darkseid (True Form) How is 9 year old girl stronger then a god ?
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Maria Ushiromiya (Umineko Verse) How is a voice stronger than furniture
Vers05
2 months member
1.9K
Darkseid (True Form) Yeah and maria lost to a furinture
Aleazlllll
12 months member
103K
Death Of The Endless any of the endless one shots team 1
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Maria Ushiromiya (Umineko Verse) He is called God but singing alien guy killed him
Danyel
1 months member
502
The Fulcrum The Fulcrum stomps.
Vers05
2 months member
1.9K
Darkseid (True Form) But darkseid is a god. Alien god so Maria stands no chance.
Dont get me wrong. is not like i hate maria. She one of my favourite charachters in Umineko.
But Darkseid gods stomps entrire Umineko just by existing
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Maria Ushiromiya (Umineko Verse) Didn't Superman use a machine to kill this darkseid by singing
Vers05
2 months member
1.9K
Darkseid (True Form) Maria is young and naive she belives everything elders tell her is true. Also Umineko got debunk. There are no gods or witches. Featherine is just a alien just like Hanyuu. They are aliens that just have advanced technology. After all "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic"
Vers05
2 months member
1.9K
Darkseid (True Form) That what she belives but it a lie. "But Im diffrent i was born from Mama alone; .That is a lie. It stated that maria has a father that left Rosa when she wasnt even born.
Danyel
1 months member
502
Dyno and meggy
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Maria Ushiromiya (Umineko Verse) She is destined to become greatest Creator of all time

She can manifest in a layer above the Meta-World, in which she stands superimposed over the scenery and perceives events there as frozen in time, as well as the Cathedral beyond both. Can access the Golden Land, which is stated to exist on an even higher level than all of the above, and together with Beatrice can shape it with her thoughts
blitzed Meta World Rosa
Surpasses the World of Witches and all of it's infinite meta layers
Unbound by the limits of the Human Domain, surpassing it's concepts of weight and mass. Can carry Kakera, entire worlds with infinite possibilities, on her hands
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Maria Ushiromiya (Umineko Verse) Maria stomps
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
@Galactus bruh not sure why i didn't get 3 notifications on your replies but according to villains wiki: His name was said to be "Bubba Sawyer" in the second film. In the third film, his nickname was Junior with the family name being Sawyer just like the second film. In official merchandise and the online horror game Dead by Daylight, his name is given as Bubba Sawyer.
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Team The Creeper (Jeepers Creepers) Actually Jigsaw would beat him because he is a older more experienced Kevin
Last edited: 27 d ago.
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
I have a dog and a cat at my home where in village but in town i have 2 cats
RatnikNaSjeveru2005
20 months member
10.8K
Wow what are they name